Perhaps a force of nature?

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Van Canna
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Post by Van Canna »

Hey, Francesca, nice name....are you Sicilian? :)
Van
Victor Smith
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Post by Victor Smith »

Bill,

Bet you guy's never thought of this one <GRIN>.

Dillman Short http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKqfLJK1FwE
Victor Smith
bushi no te isshinryu
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Van Canna
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Post by Van Canna »

Interesting KO, Victor.

Though as a soccer player I have been hit in the same spot by powerful kicks with soccer shoes/cleets....many times....and mostly shrugged off to continue play.
Van
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Panther
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Post by Panther »

I took a similar kick a little while back when doing security at a club... The other person was the one who ended up down & out! Don't get me wrong, it hurt, but that just pi$$ed me off. I also took a shot from an athletic woman wearing spike heals that just missed the jewels (well... glancing) and that hurt too. I had to deal with a massive bruise down there, but she had to deal with the charges and silver bracelets. B I T C... you get the idea.

I'm thinking more and more that a lot of Dillman's ukes are just really good ukes for him.
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Van Canna
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Post by Van Canna »

Yup...the hypnotic factor is there.
Van
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Panther
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Post by Panther »

HA! I just KO'ed the world for 86 nanoseconds and they didn't even realize it! I think I should be elevated to 666-dan immediately and everyone should prostrate themselves before me... (hahahahaha... he said "prostrate"... hehehehe)

:splat: :rofl:

OK... sorry... that was just bad of me... guess I'm in "one of those moods" today! :wink:

Wish I was on the cape doin' a little "sunrise sanchin"! :puppydogeyes: <- that's also jealous...
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Van Canna
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Post by Van Canna »

All in all...the kyusho pressure points do work and are useful to know where they are to improve our targeting and efficiency in striking to stop.

My student Jim Hulse from England is awesome in this and he teaches kyusho strikes from Uechi without fanfare.
Van
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Panther
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Post by Panther »

I'm a firm believer in kyusho striking... been on both sides... (Hi, Jim M.! - just invoking his name makes me start "tingling"... not in THAT way, get your head outta the gutter, you perv! :lol: )

My comments are purely based on the fact that they do not always work and they certainly don't work on everyone. I'll give them a try in the middle of stuff, but will also abandon them if they're not effective in the fray. I've used them and thought, "damn, that was easy" and also used them and thought, "oh crap, that didn't work... here we go..." Sometimes anything in the vicinity will take someone down and other times you can get the strike perfectly on target and the person just looks at you with death in their eyes... naturally, like everyone else, I prefer the former! Unfortunately, I (warning: personal opinion alert) think that it's a disservice to the masses for people to always see them miraculously work.

And THAT is one of the reasons I have so damn much respect for Maloney-Sensei. I was part of one of his seminars where he was demonstrating the various kyusho techniques... as usual, his uke was very susceptible to them, which is all well and good for general demonstration purposes; however there was one guy that it just didn't seem to work on... no matter WHO did it. He just kinda stood there with this growing smirk on his face. Maloney-Sensei used it as a (what's the current term-du-jour) "teachable moment" and had everyone watch as he hit this guy with a number of different pressure point techniques with pretty minor responses from the guy. Then Maloney-Sensei informed everyone exactly what I already knew and said above... it doesn't always work... in that case you need to "soften them up" (his words) with something more along the lines of punching, kicking, joint-locks, etc. (Which he then demonstrated flawlessly...) I guess my point is that I take instructors who won't admit that it doesn't always work with a very large grain of salt... just as I do instructors who make excuses for why something doesn't work. To me, if it works... do it. If it doesn't work, move on to something else and try that. BTW... I did a no-touch KO of the entire world while you were reading this! :lol:

(I guess my irreverence is gonna get me in trouble with some folks, but then again... what's new... 8) )
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Bill Glasheen
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Post by Bill Glasheen »

Hello to all! Camp is good. Wishing you were all here. Van and I had a very nice chat yesterday.

Get your arse over here, Panther! I had to travel undercover just to get here this year. So... No excuses!

I am in agreement with what Panther and Van said. Some targeted sequential striking (a.k.a. kyusho) is good stuff. Some is BS. And there are a lot of snake oil salesmen out there - including and ESPECIALLY the ones (no names mentioned) who make fun of those who call them snake oil salesmen. Sorry... I'm a "Missouri" kind of guy (e.g. show me). Do it in a controlled setting with someone other than your own fall guy, or forgetaboutit. I've burst a few bubbles before in such controlled settings. A writeup of one such test is elsewhere on this site.

The sad part of the damage done by the PT Barnum crowd is that there is something to targeted sequential striking. It just makes perfect common sense to know where to hit, what order to hit someone, and know why it works. That's no Asian mystical mumbo jumbo; that's evidence-based fighting (a.k.a. RBSD).
Panther wrote:
My comments are purely based on the fact that they do not always work and they certainly don't work on everyone.
I just wanted to flesh this statement out a bit.

Kyusho points that work via pain are points which are more likely to fail on you when you need them most. The more neurohormonally someone is jacked up (via endogenous or exogenous means), the less all the pain stuff matters.

HOWEVER....

Points which rely on reflexes WILL work when someone is jacked up. These points must work, or the person can't function. Learning the difference between the two is key. In general these reflex points are the ones to go with because they have broad application context-wise AND they place you in a better position by disabling the structure of your opponent. So even if your bad guy is stronger, more jacked up, or more determined, you're going to be better off because you're briefly destroying his/her ability to use balance or core strength. Will they make for fun PT Barnum KO shows? Nope... But they work when you need them most, and that isn't with one of your students in front of people paying seminar tuition to you.

Offended anyone yet? Too bad... This is about saving lives. Egos go out the door here.

Also... My philosophy is that kyusho should be the poison on the end of your spear. In other words, your technique should still accomplish something even without the force multiplier effect. That way you're left with something if you have a "nonresponder" situation.

- Bill
Ted Dinwiddie
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Post by Ted Dinwiddie »

I am late to the party, but for the last 18 years or so I have been practicing under instructors who were Dillmanites for a long time. He lost the respect of some of his top guys and Mr. Oyata and his people HATE him. Unfortunately, I think Mr. Dillman is more footnote than anything at this point. I have not watched all the videos, but we practice this list plus quite few. Taikyoku 1 is an 8th Kyu kata in our school and I have students preparing for 8th Kyu that do a WAY better version than that one.
ted

"There's only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - P.J. O'Rourke
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Panther
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Post by Panther »

I'd get there if I could Bill-Sensei.

I had a situation a number of years ago where I tried EVERYTHING on this huge guy... WAY bigger than me and NOTHING worked! He was determined to kick SOMEBODY'S @$$ and I had been elected. He was major jacked up on PCP. I was calm (to start) because he wasn't moving all that great. He tagged me once a little, so I decided to use kyusho and end it at that point. Didn't work. Tried a number of other points/combinations... nothing. Guy just laughed at me. I reached the "eff this" point and went to the ole "knee to the nuts"... Bill, I swear that guy was never going to have kids again, but he just smiled and grabbed me! That's when I had the proverbial "oh sh*t" moment... Ended up having to dislocate his knee so he couldn't chase me as I beat feet outta there! Found out that it took 7 cops to get him cuffed and into the wagon9with as many more standing around as backup! (This was before tazers were ever thought about.) He ended up with his leg in a cast for a few months and a whole lot of bruises, but that was little comfort to me! If I'd had a knife or gun that night, he'd have been dead and from my conversations with the local constabulary, I would have been fully justified. I'm too damn old to "duke it out" with some drugged up punk now... I go straight for the pepper/club/knife/gun... they'll kill you otherwise. I would hate to think what would have happened to someone without any training at that guy's hands that night. There are lots of guests of the state who pounded (sometimes to death) someone without any training while they were drugged up and belligerent.

Say "Hi" to Van, George, Jim, Gary, Roy, Margret, Bobby, David, Dana, and apologies to anyone I've left out... I'll try to be there next year...

:cry:
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