Soft / hard style ?

[Gary Santaniello]

Certainly all uechiryu karate people understand the concept of having both half-hard & half-soft in their style.
However, i have seen some extreme of hardness whereas "power" is the primary focus, and the other extreme of "softness" where flowing movements are so combined that no power appears to be present.

I understand that the Chinese styles tend to be more soft and flowing whereas Japanese systems are much harder. We (in uechi) pull from both.
One may argue that the "chi" in Chinese systems contain enough power in them therefore not needing to display strength in the movements. On the other hand some feel the need to display hardness in "everything".

It is my belief that in uechi one should be accelerating blocks and strikes with "focus" on the end of each movement. Therefore increasing ones hitting and blocking techniques as needed.

I feel that the "concept" of having both soft and hard within a system is most difficult for many to grasp. Seeing how "most" styles reflect only one or the other i think that the instructors tend to control the mind set of the students in this area.

How hard is to hard ? How soft is to soft? Once we feel it within ourselves
how do we pass it on to our students?
Hardness does eventually cause problems with the bodies joints, tendons etc, etc. To soft reflects lack of power and focus often leading to sloppy form with lack of hitting power.

How do you feel about it ?



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Gary S.

[Collin Warder]

It is my belief that hard and soft directly relate to emptiness and fullness. One who practices a hard style would prefer to meet fullness with fullness whereas one who practices a soft style would prefer to meet fullness with emptiness. Blocking vrs. parrying. I don't believe practioners of soft styles are lacking in power. I take a soft approach to the arts and I like to believe that my punches sting as much as the next guy's I can say that after just a year in Wing Chun my puches packed much more wallop than they had in my previous years of Kempo.

As far as my knowledge goes, not nearly all of the Chinese sytems are soft. The softer styles tend to be those developed on the civil level, to deal with heavely armed and armored opponents. There are many northern styles that can be considered hard. Also, there is a great many Japanese systems that are soft. Ju-Jutsu's specific emphasis is to complete the harmony of energies in battle. This is the same for Aiki Ju-Jitsu and Aikido. Shorinji Kempo has a similar approach.

-Collin

[Gary Santaniello]

Collin,

I stand corrected. Yes the aikido and jujitsu styles are soft in their approch to flowing with the attack. I was focusing more on the "karate" styles such as Shotokan, Gojo-ryu, and other Japanese /Okinawan styles that reflect much hardness in them as compared to many of the Kungfu chinese systems which uechi originated from.(Pangainoon)

I understand that the Okinawans converted the softer style of Uechi-ryu (originally a kungfu system) of origin into a harder system in which the Americans followed.

Having seen a tape of Sensei Mattsons visit to China, it appears that all the public display of common practices are soft and flowing. I feel that a lot of movements such as in blocking and striking in the forms are incomplete when one tries to "flow" from one movement to another which ends up being rushed.

Certainly Tai Chi and some other systems perform their movements in this continuos fashin and i doubt not that your soft approach has affect in the strikes as you say.

However i feel that whereas the uechi system contains both Hard and soft in it, many have difficulty with both elements being present.

I have found that in performing Kata one can do it either in Hard form, soft form and/or combining both. At least i feel able to do so.

I see some schools and students being very hard and rigid and others being soft and flowing. Maybe it is due to my rescent exsposure to more "variety" of practicioners whom seem to go to either one extreme or the other that has made me more "aware" of it.

Anyway, i was curious how other uechi-ryu practioners may feel regarding the soft and hard subject.

Thank you for your input.


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Gary S.

[Bill Glasheen]

Gary

I believe this to be a very complex subject with many relevant facets. I also believe there to be a lot of misunderstanding in the meaning of hard and soft.

As an example of the latter, I point out to my students that part of the "hard soft" of Uechiryu has to do with the posture of sanchin. On the one hand, we want firm spinal posture (pelvic tuck), firm shoulder frame (contracted latissimus dorsi) and firm hands. On the other hand, we want springy legs, a slightly rotating waist, and relaxed muscles in the shoulder and upper arm that allow a thrust or strike to be fast and focused. The relaxation in certain upper-body muscles is also critical to transferring energy from the legs and hips through the spine to the striking hand. Particularly when you consider the firmness and strength needed to do open-handed techniques, this mixture of hard and soft can easily take a decade (or more) to master. For a long time, people are either too tense and lack speed/focus, or too relaxed in the hands or posture and so cannot deliver the unique hand thrusts of the Uechi system. From what I see at black belt tests, some advanced students still don't have it down.

Another aspect of hard soft you speak of is loosely related to yielding vs. meeting force with force. Trust me, the yielding (softness) in aikido and jiujitsu has nothing to do with sloppiness. Precision is the only way to make these "soft" techniques work. The reason most people start off "hard" (unyielding) is because it is easier to learn - even if they don't have a lot of strength and/or mass. The problem with the yielding and energy transformation techniques (using someone's force against them) is that it takes so bloody long to learn how to do them. One needs to be sensitive enough to "read" the opponent, and "schooled" enough to react without thinking. All these wonderful "soft" techniques can last you a lifetime - well beyond when our bodies begin to betray us. But the catch is that they require the best of skill to apply.

As for power generation, well I'm not really of the school of chi - until someone can show me something that qualifies as a force that I don't recognize. But any good student of kinesiology, biomechanics, and sports physiology can tell you that there are many interesting and complex ways to generate power. I've seen quite a variety of ways just in the many folks that do a simple sanchin thrust.

And frankly a lot of what people classify as "hard" fall into what I would just call primative. A good athlete is a good althlete. You do not need to talk to a major league shortstop about hard vs. soft when it comes to flow. They'll catch a screaming grounder and rifle it to first base in a way that makes it look like they aren't even trying. But just be a first baseman for a day and you know otherwise. Looks can be deceiving. Flowing from movement to movement is just plain smart. Yes, there is a time to focus individual movements, but advanced practioners just don't do it de riguere. Watch an experienced fighter fight. Do you see ichi, ni, san type movements? Of course not. In fact the uneducated eye often can't see what's going on. And the practioner? Well many of the good ones don't know what they have done until they do it. That's what good training does for you.

Hope this stimulates the thinking some on this subject.

- Bill

[This message has been edited by Bill Glasheen (edited 08-16-99).]

[Shelly King]

We attempt to learn the hard/soft form of kata from day one. We spend much of our time(keeping in mind I am only beginning) breaking kata down into each elemental move, learning when to relax the muscles and how to tighten them back and focus for the next strike. Needless to say it is something I am know where near grasping.

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Shelly

[Collin Warder]

Gary Sensei:

I feel that a lot of movements such
as in blocking and striking in the forms are incomplete when one tries to "flow" from one
movement to another which ends up being rushed.

I agree with you 100% There is a small partner training drill that I do called Counter for Counter which teaches "flow". The most common mistake is blending the movemements so much that you wind up stumbling over yourself and incapable of dealing with the next punch that is SURE to come. I also agree with you when you infer that the harder styles express a more completeness in techniques.

I think that it is the natural evolution of a skilled fighter to express his or her art, regardless of whatever it is, in a blended soft-hard fashion. Only the fool will discount the benefits of the two genres. This is one thing that intrigues so much about Uechi, and I look forward to begining my training in your art.

-Collin

[Collin Warder]

Ok I have to amend my previous post. What Bill said...right on No really, when I said I agree with the slopiness of the softer styles, I was implying those with limited training (myself included). It is very diffucult to "read" and "react" in the way that softer styles teach without years of training. Sprites like myself just appear to be a splathering mess.

At some point the dichotomy dissapears and the fighter is both soft and hard. As Bill said, the skilled martial artist will flow from technique to technique and though it may apear to the untrained eye as flailing limbs, the techniques are actually being executed with extreme precision and speed.

-Collin