Terry Dukes: Inventing a martial art

SEAN C · Post by **SEAN C** » Thu Jun 22, 2000 3:27 am

Janicic,

I'm sorry, I don't know anything about any specific teachings called "Chinese Yoga". I do feel that yoga and chi kung might be very closely related. Where does all this stuff come from anyway? Some people say India and Tibet.

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sean

Bod Boulton · Post by **Bod Boulton** » Fri Jun 23, 2000 5:57 am

Janicic,

If you want to know more about Chinese Yoga, read the article <a href="http://www.geocities.com/mushindokai/cy ... .html">The Evolution of Chinese Yoga</a> and the related ones. You can also check out OKI yoga for yourself to see similarities. It is taught in Holland by Sensei Oki's secretary, Mizue.

Toby Bray is at TobyBray@aol.com.

<a href="mailto:bodboulton@yahoo.co.uk">Bod Boulton</a>

[This message has been edited by Bod Boulton (edited June 22, 2000).]

janicic · Post by **janicic** » Sat Jul 08, 2000 3:30 am

Thank you for your reply.

The site with an article about Chinese Yoga you are suggesting
http://www.geocities.com/mushindokai/cyf/cyfevolves.html

cannot be accessed from China.

Would it be a trouble to e-mail me that article as an attachment.

Best Regards

Jaco

janicic@yahoo.com

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bod Boulton:
Janicic,

If you want to know more about Chinese Yoga, read the article <a href="http://www.geocities.com/mushindokai/cy ... .html">The Evolution of Chinese Yoga</a> and the related ones. You can also check out OKI yoga for yourself to see similarities. It is taught in Holland by Sensei Oki's secretary, Mizue.

Toby Bray is at TobyBray@aol.com.

<a href="mailto:bodboulton@yahoo.co.uk">Bod Boulton</a>

[This message has been edited by Bod Boulton (edited June 22, 2000).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

SEAN C · Post by **SEAN C** » Sat Jul 08, 2000 4:31 pm

Janicic,

I wanted to clarify my post regarding "Chinese Yoga". Much ado about absolutely nothing. It took me awhile to see how it could be misleading.

In the past on a totally unrelated thread, I used the words "Chinese yoga" in a descriptive way to characterize some of the benefits of the eight pieces of brocade chi kung.

Later, from this thread, I found out that Mushindo does something called Chines yoga, of which I know nothing whatsoever. I realized that I shouldn't use the words "Chinese yoga" in the future, because people might understandably think I was referring to whatever it is that mushindo practices under this name.

I'm sorry if my post misled you in anyway.

P.S. Mantak Chia, in the book "Awaken Healing Energy Through the Tao", uses the words "Taoist Esoteric Yoga" in reference to internal energy meditation using the acupuncture meridians. He also speaks of kundalini (yoga) and chi (chi kung) as being the same.

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sean

janicic · Post by **janicic** » Sun Jul 09, 2000 11:35 am

Do the movements described in the book you are suggesting "Awaken Healing Energy Through the Tao" have anything in common with those movements that TD used in his Chinese Yoga.

My question remains the same:

Where did TD get those movements for his CY because it was a solid training as far as I'm concerned and Toby Bray expressed the same opinion in his messege posted to GM.

Or is it that I haven't seen any better?

In China I am learning Chen Style Tai Ji which is also giving me new insights.

Jaco

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SEAN C:
Janicic,

I wanted to clarify my post regarding "Chinese Yoga". Much ado about absolutely nothing. It took me awhile to see how it could be misleading.

In the past on a totally unrelated thread, I used the words "Chinese yoga" in a descriptive way to characterize some of the benefits of the eight pieces of brocade chi kung.

Later, from this thread, I found out that Mushindo does something called Chines yoga, of which I know nothing whatsoever. I realized that I shouldn't use the words "Chinese yoga" in the future, because people might understandably think I was referring to whatever it is that mushindo practices under this name.

I'm sorry if my post misled you in anyway.

P.S. Mantak Chia, in the book "Awaken Healing Energy Through the Tao", uses the words "Taoist Esoteric Yoga" in reference to internal energy meditation using the acupuncture meridians. He also speaks of kundalini (yoga) and chi (chi kung) as being the same.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

SEAN C · Post by **SEAN C** » Sun Jul 09, 2000 8:55 pm

Jaco,

"Awaken Healing Energy Throught the Tao" is mainly concerned with sitting meditation, using visualization of energy cycles.

Maybe you could find an answer for my question? I have heard that Buddhist meditation uses the seven chakras, while taoists use the upper, middle and lower dan tien. Is this always the case? Are the dan tiens just another name for the 2nd, 3rd and 4th chakras?

Maybe someone else can help you with questions about mushindo. As I stated, I don't know anything about it.

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sean

Halford · Post by **Halford** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 11:30 am

the 'dirty old man' having sex with students......this happens in yoga and related 'cults' especially in certain tantric groups,either Hindu or Tibetan,etc. So take a look also at some other 'dirty old men' in these things.For example, the Tulku/Lama Steven Seagal!

Halford · Post by **Halford** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 7:33 pm

How about Lobsang Rampa and the Third Eye, a whole series of semi-popular books? How about certain ninjutsu experts as well? Simply because a person espouses an art doesn't mean he can do it or has to do it! How many football players score touchdowns, how many baseball players hit home runs,how many basketball players score baskets,etc.? I ask this because somehow we expect a higher and more spectacular performance of what we expect martial artists, especially masters and grandmasters, to do! The same is true in yoga. The same is true in Zen and most religions! There will always be those who think that the number of pushups/pressups one can do is indication of one's mastery of martial arts, when there are masters who can't even do one and never did any their entire lives! The same is true in yoga. There are a number of really flexible persons who can twist and contort in numerous postures and poses but they only have hte physical ability or perhaps mastery of yoga which some would say that is all there is to it.

Halford · Post by **Halford** » Fri Feb 06, 2004 1:09 am

went through it briefly. I would be highly pleased to learn if those who have so vociferously criticized the book have actually read it from cover to cover. somehow I get the impression that those who have tried to read it do not understand it or the material in it they dismiss. While looking back in the notes given I find somewhat the real reason that the critics havejumped onto the work, that is, karate and in particular, Uechi practitioners, is because of the statements made by the author about these arts. One thing I did/do find somewhat irritating in Dukes' writing is his tendency to pomposity,particularly in assuming that he alone has access to the esoteric,exalted teachings and practices and by mentioning karate and Uechi specifically, he has opened himself up to vituperation from the many practitioners of these arts. I feel that this is perhaps the main focus of all the attempts to dismiss and denigrate the work,rather than any scholarly attempt to consider the aspects of Buddhism, Taoism, Hinduism,etc that seem to permeate the work. Some ahve accused Dukes of padding his bibliography and notes,etc. but except for the rather gratuitous references to his own writings, I find the references and bibliography more than adequate, interesting, and important. Dukes mentions his meetings and discussions with numerous personages who,unless they are imaginative and fictional in nature, would seem to lend some credibility to his main thesis. I suspect that most of the general readers of this work do not have the interest or the background in philosophical/religious/historical aspects and so tend to dismiss all this are irrelevant to the practical aspects of 'kicking ass'.

Rick Wilson · Post by **Rick Wilson** » Sun Feb 08, 2004 10:18 pm

Halford:

Sent you a PM.

Halford · Post by **Halford** » Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:05 pm

Thank you for replying to my topic posting(s). I went ot your website and enjoyed the visit. Glad I did since it had much of great interest. I placed in my growing favorites list. Well, as I wade through Dukes' MAGNUM OPUS, I will let you know what else I can discover about it. I have made an inquiry to a rather knowledgeable writer/scholar/martial artist about one of the references he mentions and will see what, if anything, he might be willing to share about it,etc. The book/reference he cites apparently was privately printed and so a copy of it may be most difficult to find.