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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2000 12:42 am 
Most of us in the martial arts are TOUGH! Right? I have always hated taking medicine for anything. All the "stuff" they have put in my body, chemo and all the anti chemo meds. This one for the stomach, this one for the head, this one for the other one so it makes you feel better after you take it. It goes on and on. I have always tried to avoid pain medicines. It's no different now but I have no choice. So if I have pain, I take a pill, if there is no pain, I don't take it Last week at the Hospital,they gave me a talking to about taking the pain meds. At the end I had to promise I would take the meds. morning and night even if I thought they were not needed. They explained to me the side effects that pain has on the body. Did it ever open my eyes and described me to a T. Pain not only causes the body stress but the mental stress can be even worse. Pain causes fatigue, pain causes loss of sleep, it makes one impatient, it causes ones temper to be on edge, and it goes on and on. I now take the meds. and it has helped me shake off the above symptons. I am not taking the extra stuff in between, unless I really need it. Their argument was, "We know what is causing the pain, there is nothing wrong with treating the it." I have finally admitted that sometimes it is ok to mistreat the body without the worry of turning into a addict, dependant on drugs in order to survive. If you are like me, you hate it. I'm just saying here that sometimes, it's ok. Pain can destoy your body too.
Bill


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2000 3:58 am 
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Bill-sensei - you ask some tough questions! Pain meds are a touchy subject for a lot of people - and I believe I can relate very well to your resistance to medication. Aside from an over-sensitivity to just about everything - I've always been one to "work through" the pain (which makes this injury worse because for the first time I can't do that!) and have this inherent distrust of the medical profession - from personal experience of my own involving lost family members and serious complications. I have some good friends who are practitioners of "traditional" medicine - and to their consternation I am an avid follower/practitioner of homeopathy, energy healing and other alternative therapies. My own mother bought an additional 10 years after a fatal diagnosis of malignant melanoma behind the left eye - they gave her six months at the best (that was only IF she took the rad and chemo - she didn't) - after an agressive laetrile treatment in a clinic outside the country, radical dietary changes and energy work, the drastic remission had the doctors insisting that the initial results were in "error" and the healing unexplainable - because the initial diagnosis had to be wrong (three different doctor/surgeons). OK - doctors aren't God - but it seems to the patient like sometimes they take that position - especially when something as precious as our health is at stake - and we feel so helpless...

Back to pain meds - yea, I consider myself too tough for them. But I have succumbed - I'm currently under the influence of 800 mg of Ibuprofen in the hopes that I'll get more than an hour's sleep tonight... but I digress again. Martial arts making one tougher? Perhaps... I finished a dan kumite one time after breaking my ankle in three places during number two of the second set - even finished with the takedown... and had to be helped off the floor once I bowed out. Came back to class the next night and stood in the back doing all the arm motions of hojoundo and the katas, just so I didn't miss a class. Finished the month doing a clumsy version with my ankle triple wrapped - luckily I've got no permanent damage from that stupidity. Then there was the time I finished the last minute and a half of a sparring match after dislocating two ribs from a hook kick to the back - crazy the things you can do when you are "in the mode." Then there's that 9lb 3oz baby that I HAD to have naturally... but I won't go there!

Back to pain meds again... I truly can see the points made about the effects of pain on the body and the mind - and yes - these things need to be addressed! But I still have problems with a continual dosage. Again, I am nowhere near the seriousness of your situation, but I would still worry about the side-effects of constant usage. Perhaps the results justify those side effects. But why take it when the pain is bearable? What about "building up a tolerance" to the meds - and then needing to continuosly increase the dosage? Or a dependency, perceived or otherwise, so that one missed dose spells major misery?

I'm probably the wrong person to put in my two cents about that - given my negative experiences with prescriptions and ultimatums from doctors, (which I won't bore you with here!) but as an educator I constantly maintain my position that we all have to educate ourselves as much as possible about every thing that affects us to the best of our ability. This does get exhausting - and sometimes it is easier to simply trust the "experts." That is what we pay them for isn't it? But I would still question things like:
What are ALL the side effects of every med they reccommend?
What are the withdrawal symptoms from missing one dose or one day or even one week after long term usage?
What kind of alternative therapies are they willing to work with?

If J.D. reads this he'll be all over with his rhetoric and denial and scientific method and all that jazz... but I sincerely believe and have seen with myself and with friends some amazing pain management through homeopathy and energy healing. Some doctors in my neck of the woods are actually starting to accept the use of homeopathy and healing touch as a complement to conventional treatment, and my homeopath has a number of cancer patients who swear by the treatment of their cases for pain managment and nausea and other problems arising from chemo and rad therapy. Same goes for healing touch and Reiki.

I'm not saying I'm pro or con the pain meds - only that extra questions can't hurt - if you have the inclination to do so - and your post seems to indicate that you do... so there's my two cents!

Godspeed and God Bless,
Lori


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2000 11:48 pm 
Hi Lori,
That's a great post. It answers one question about ma people being tough. Of course that was really a known anyway. Your experiences with injuries really ring a bell. Isn't it something what we just take in stride. I can remember one sparring session, I took a real good shot in my left eye area. (we didn't wear any type pads in those days,no hands or feet). We used control to the head but that sometimes went out the window too. Anyway, that night I started getting a shiner, a real beaute that kept spreading and spreading. The next night when I got to the dojo, my teacher Art Rabesa was there and a fellow named John from out of town who would visit us about once a month and work out. I walk in and when Art saw my face he said "See John, I told you it was a good class last night." Typical Rabesa. lol. We loved it though. Getting back to the meds. must say that I have resorted to the conventional stuff. I had to make a quick decision when I was first diagnosed, to go conventional treatment or alternative. Since we knew nothing about this type cancer, my wife and I decided to go conventional. Radiation, chemo, bone marrow transplant and all the rest. I did get some pain relief, big time from Steve Benson, his hands did wonders for me. You are right about Dr. X. He doesn't agree, but many doctors are beginning to change and are looking at these different treatments. If it works do it, that's my way of thinking. The conventional treatment and meds. for me, maybe, gave me some time, they have now failed, now I am trying more. I just heard today that a young lady, a friends daughter, who has the same cancer as I do, has relapsed after her xplant, only 2 yrs ago. I saw her after her xplant and several times since, encouraging her and now she has relapsed too. I haven't told her about my condition because I was always there for her and I think it would really shake her unnecessarily. It bothers me when they are so young. Well got off the track there. I may have a new "spot" rearing it's ugly head. Will know Monday if it is Myeloma related. They think so. The doctors now want me to increase the pain meds. and truthfully, I've had to do that. I hope the radiation takes care of the pain and the pills won't be necessary. I don't think I have to be worried about addiction. I just hate to give in. I will be doing my san chin sideways. lol. Bye for now.
Bill


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2000 3:59 am 
I've crossed the line once with the pain meds business, Bill. Sooner or later, one gets tired of the hurt. Enough is enough; not a case of loosing.

You've got other battles to win which are more important than concerning yourself about addiction right now and I want to see you win again.


------------------
Allen, now at his new website http://www.ury2k.com/pulse/index.htm


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2000 11:03 pm 
J.D. and Lori,
Perhaps both of you think that my being reluctant about taking pain med. is being tough, or being afraid of what it will do to my body. Well, I guess that is part of it. But when I had a bunch of pain, before my transplant, NEMC people kept offering pain meds and I kept refusing. They constantly had warned me not to overdo, don't do anything that could break a bone, the bones were fragile. Well I finally told them, if I have to be careful and not overdo, how can I tell that if I'm covering it up with medicine. Well, they finally agreed with me. I must admit I was probably more active than most with the same disease. But I wanted to know where I was at, the pain did that. This time they said we know what is causing the pain, so take the meds. and be comfortable. Well, I have and they have increased the doses and I have made myself as comfortable as possible. This time around, I couldn't take the pain. After all the chemo, other meds. and radiation, there isn't much more this stuff can do to me. So I have given in. How's that J.D., and I can't afford to take the time to see if any alternative would work. As soon as I can get off it, it's gone. Do I feel like a whimp??? Nope.
Bill


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2000 10:18 pm 
J.D. we disagree, I have not taken control, I have given in. The disease and the Doctors are in control. How can anyone taking drugs like this have control? I am in the hands of my doctors. If it hurts, they prescribe a pill, if it hurts more, they say take two. The only control I have is to decide how to take it, with water? Or something else. I have given in. Given in, not given up.
Bill


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2000 4:28 am 
J.D.,,Now we agree.
Bill


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2000 12:38 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 16, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 6007
Location: Mount Dora, Florida
You're a 'fiesty' old fart Bill! Please stop picking on our good Doktor.

Now people will better appreciate all the abuse I must take while playing golf with you.



------------------
GEM


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2000 1:56 pm 
Oh Oh, cheezit everybody, the boss is back. Don't know why he isn't out on the golf course at 7:30 AM. After all it's only 30 degrees. It just means one extra layer George, and maybe ice skates. and you do need the practice.
Bill


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2000 4:40 pm 
Now that my radiation treatments are over, I thought maybe I would experiment a bit with the pain meds and see if the radiation helped. Well, it didn't, yet. I am anxious to cut back as soon as possible but have learned the importance of a "level" program to at least be comforable. I have in mind to visit Steve Benson. Why not before?? Well it is very hard for us to meet, quite a distance away. I will be working on a meeting though, anxious to see if he makes a difference this time. I know, if it does make a difference, it will be because the time was right for the radiation or meds to make it better. Sorry J.D. lol.
Bill


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2000 4:59 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 16, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 6007
Location: Mount Dora, Florida
Since Brockton is midway between you two, let me know if you and Steve would like to meet at my home.

Best,
George

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GEM


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