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PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 1999 2:30 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 157
Location: Evansville, IN, USA
Greetings Friends,

What do you folks think about these recent lawsuits various cities are bringing against the gun industry?

The claim (for those that haven't heard) is that the gun industry purposefully makes more guns than the possible legal demand and in particular make guns available where the know they will fall into the hands of criminals (I am interested to see how they try will prove that second part).

The cities want changes to safety measures on guns, and how guns are sold. Assuming that the various cities are successful do you think this will lead to an actual easing of restrictions for good legal-minded citizens to get firearms?

Osu!
Jason


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 1999 12:31 am 
Jason,

Take aim at this. It's more than you want to know. http://cnn.com/US/9901/27/gun.lawsuits/

Take note of the gun laws of each state.

Allen

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web: http://www.uechi-ryu.org email: <A HREF="mailto:uechi@ici.net">uechi@ici.net</A>


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 1999 1:04 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 3754
Location: Richmond, VA
Nice website referral Allen. Thanks.

Jason: What this will ultimately mean to law abiding folks is that handguns will be more expensive, harder to get, and more complex and prone to failure due to the safety add-ons that states will soon require. I predict that the law of unintended consequences will cost someone their life or limb. The feds will be next to act. Also, the bad guys will still have guns anyway.

What this tells me is that I better go get one tomorrow while I still can. And I will - a nice semi auto Glock .45!

Fortunately, Virginia is sufferring from the anti tobacco legislation and understands the harm done by these lawsuits. Even better, our conservative governor is literally a poster boy for the NRA, so we have time here to act.

Virginia's only limit on handgun purchases is a cap of one per month. Private sales are another matter and not regulated with no record keeping required.

BTW, statistically, guns are safer than bicycles, cars, swimming pools, roller skates,....... and the use of firearms is more accident free than participation in any team sport in the U.S.

The bottom line is that the pols are smelling money!

Rich

[This message has been edited by RACastanet (edited 01-28-99).]


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 1999 4:17 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 157
Location: Evansville, IN, USA
Assuming for a moment that the charge that gun makers have been oversupplying states with weaker gun laws since they know they will end up in the black market, do you think they should be held accountable for this?

I admit I am on the fence on this. In one sense (common sense perhaps) they have to know that there guns are ending up in the black market, but in another sense how could they really know this or track this fact? To a business all they would see is very high sales in that state, and hence a high demand, and hence a high supply. Thats economics. I don't know ... I dislike frivolous law suits, but I dislike companies that could care less about people and care more about money (i.e. I think the tabacoo industry got what it deserved).

Allen, thanks very much for the link.

Osu!
Jason


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 1999 1:24 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 3754
Location: Richmond, VA
Well Jason, I spoke to soon. Today the city of Richmond announced it was looking into joining the other cities in the handgun lawsuits. Richmond has long had a serious problem in the city, and until this year ranked up there with Detroit and New Orleans in per capita murders. New and tough rules and penalties have cut the murder rate by about 30% in one year. Unfortunately, it seems Baltimore has picked up the slack.

Virginia was a gun oversupplier until recently. No limits on quantities. Now, it is one handgun per month and a lot of forms and ID are required for the on site background check. Before the new laws, it seemed we were inviting felons and out of staters to stock up here, and the manufacturers simply supplied the market. I'm not for gun control, but one a month seems reasonable, and dealers and legitimate collectors can still purchase all they want.

Other factors have driven the decrease in murders: new no parole laws, mandatory 5 year sentences for possessing and using an illegal firearm, lots of big new nasty prisons for serious offenders. Our last governor was really tough on crime. However, under him (George Allen), Virginia instituted a 'right to carry' law which enables good guys like me to get a permit. Now, in addition to tougher laws, the street toughs also fear that almost everyone is 'carrying' - and that IS their biggest fear!

Rich


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 1999 12:11 pm 
At first one thinks that the lawsuits of cities vs gun manufacturers is stupid and frivolious but it is just another move to remove gun ownership from private hands.

Better stock up on handguns and rifles now while you can still legally get them.

Y'know, if the amount of time and money pumped into attempts to delete personal gun ownership over the past 20 some-odd years would have been invested in fighting crime instead, the streets could have been a lot safer today.

ASIDE: High crime rate in New Orleans, eh? I once lived there. It seemed like one out of ten cars had a handgun sitting on top of the dashboard. What shocked me one morning while crossing a busy intersection walking to work, were three cars in a row at the front of the line waiting for the light to turn green. Each one had a pistol on top the dashboard, plainly visible for all the world to see. Such a deterrent to prevent traffic altercations; a detergent to keep the streets clean.

Intimidated? That was the last time I walked to work in New Orleans.



[This message has been edited by moulton (edited 01-30-99).]


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