Uechi-Ryu.com

Discussion Area
It is currently Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:26 am

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 26 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 5:45 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
Got this from our friend Richard Dean Gibbons of MBS martial systems.

http://www.kyusho.com/uncovered/

Quote:
It must be good for young and old, strong and not, agile and not… most of all it must be possible for all to attain and gain the best protection with. And under the restrictions of what and what is not acceptable in modern society. You can no longer teach someone to gouge an eye or destroy them physically and expect to claim self defense in a court of law… it is deemed over excessive use of force as well as a legal breech that even if it was in your defense, it is seen as a crime against the attacker. So it must also fit into acceptable means of protection without brutality.

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 5:47 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
Quote:
Once it was uncovered it was then taken into the long 5 year field testing methods to validate this vital information. But we did not rest on that alone as we employed the assistance of a Nuero specialist: Dr. Raymond Noschang, M.D to medically verify all that was discovered as well as the refinements necessary and or Restoration procedures. Once accomplished and refined, the information was then creating new practical methods and instructional means to assure it is assimilated correctly and efficiently into the trainees own personal capabilities and or restraints.

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 5:53 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
Quote:
We have begun instruction of this in our current third phase of training, as it lays the groundwork for the 4th and 5th, on a more exclusive basis for now. We do this as we pride ourselves on the highest quality of information in practical means of use under high stress and spontaneous needs that real conflict or attack bears. It will become more public only after our stringent field testing, verification and assimilation protocols deem it worthy. This will ramify on all athletes and sports, medical and health professions as well all Martial Arts.


This is of interest, Richard. Do we have any videos of this working for a weaker person against a non compliant much bigger/heavier assailant[s] in the chaos of a street attack where both are fueled by huge amounts of adrenaline?

Image

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 12:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 2:18 pm
Posts: 1200
Location: Wells Beach , Me.
Funny you guys are talking about this on this thread because I've been experimenting with this in my Thursday night sessions.
Initially just to learn the 'fancy names' of the target areas that we strike.....But in the long run to see if I could enhance the 'little guys' chances in an RMA situation.

I did some in depth work on this with my team back after my first surgery. I was in a weakened state from being 'chopped, split and delivered' and was trying to 'decode' the Bubishi I found on large, non compliant, adrenaline charged opponents that often my first choice didnt work. Eventually with a little 'Uechi Spice' ( Thanks Arthur) the Kyosho was a good product mix for a 'Uechika'.

_________________
FEARS Ltd
"Art meets Reality"
www.fearsltd.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 2:36 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
Hi Robb,

Thanks for the comment.

I don't want to appear as knocking Kyusho's effectiveness. No question that the human body has nerve strike points that when struck do produce an effect.

But I have always been skeptical of the 'light touch' kos…especially when claimed to be 'easy to apply' by a weaker person, under the effects of the chemical cocktail being affected by loss of fine motor skills, which at least impact, in my opinion, the ability of 'sequential striking' of chaotic moving targets in an opponent who is much bigger and stronger[ even more so under his own chemical cocktail where he feels no pain] and is pounding the hell out of you in a street fight.

I attended several Kyusho seminars and what I experienced was not very much convincing….especially when they got into the 'no touch' Kos...which did nothing for me[ I was told I needed to relax...and even then it didn't work] but that just me...other people were just flopping over.

Reason why I continue to remain interested in being educated in the modalities of Kyusho and in the stated practical means of use under high stress and spontaneous needs that real conflict or attack bears.

My forum is all about realities, at least as I perceive them, and I would gain much understanding in seeing how some of these kyusho concepts work under reality situations.

Take for example the recent stabbing of the forest rangers by a crazed homeless person on the Boston Common.

The article states
Quote:
It must be good for young and old, strong and not, agile and not… most of all it must be possible for all to attain and gain the best protection with. And under the restrictions of what and what is not acceptable in modern society. You can no longer teach someone to gouge an eye or destroy them physically and expect to claim self defense in a court of law… it is deemed over excessive use of force as well as a legal breech that even if it was in your defense, it is seen as a crime against the attacker. So it must also fit into acceptable means of protection without brutality.



I have heard this before, over and over, but I would like to be shown how this is achieved.

Also is it possible to KO a sparring partner in a sparring match with sequential light strikes without hurting him?

Have you tried this, or seen this Robb?

The best and no-nonsense kyusho/Uechi combo ko applications I have seen are the ones that my dear friend from England, Jim Hulse, teaches, and has made him a favorite on the European MA theatre, if you will.

http://www.uechiryu-karate.co.uk/mainpage.htm

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 12:59 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 2:18 pm
Posts: 1200
Location: Wells Beach , Me.
I am a very harsh critic, (Joe Lewis ...Art Rabesa and Jim Maloney reinforced that... lol) The guy I teach with is a 5th dan under George Dillman, I call him on the 'fantasy of the 'tap, tap' use of Kyosho' on a nightly basis. I have 'BEASTED' my way through the techniques repeatedly. BUT for the labeling and mapping of 'premium target areas' these guys know their 'stuff' my critique is still in progress so I'll with hold judgement until I experience more. My understanding though is Jim Hulse is a 'real deal' practicioner of this style.....I think because he uses a 'Uechi Flair' I'm trying to do the same but also using the 3 rythums Joe Lewis ingrained in me (Head, Footwork, firepower) These Kyosho guys have difficulty stabalizing 'the target when you employ three rythums against them

_________________
FEARS Ltd
"Art meets Reality"
www.fearsltd.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 1:54 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 2:18 pm
Posts: 1200
Location: Wells Beach , Me.
Checked out the page......As I suspected this guy is 'the real deal'....I assure you 'light touch' isn't in HIS vocabulary !!!
Nor is it in mine ..... maximum impact potential is the essence of what we train for ie:Art Rabesa, Jim Maloney, Bob Bethany and of course, yourself. I think if we want an experienced 'real deal' discourse on Kyosho we need to hear from GM Jim Hulse himself.

_________________
FEARS Ltd
"Art meets Reality"
www.fearsltd.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 3:32 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
Good points Robb...I like the expression of 'Beasting' thru the 'taps'...or 'tulips'

I also remember the seminar flops of someone trying a no touch KO on me...I had a hard time keeping a straight face.

'Beasting' is what we will be up against in the street against adrenaline charged assailants, who might not go down even after you shoot them with a .45 [ as you know there is evidence ]...

Jim Hulse is the real deal, because in addition to knowing the 'map' every shot coming at you is for full destruction...and one look at Jim we realize he is the 'beastly man' of Liverpool...and a consummate gentleman.

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 2:18 pm
Posts: 1200
Location: Wells Beach , Me.
I hope I have the opportunity to train with him next time he crosses the pond. In the mean time I will keep "Beasting through the 'tulips' ''

_________________
FEARS Ltd
"Art meets Reality"
www.fearsltd.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 9:31 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
:)

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 4:45 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 2:18 pm
Posts: 1200
Location: Wells Beach , Me.
https://sites.google.com/site/fearsltd2011/home/events-blog/martialsecretsmeetmartialreality

So I wrote this while in the hospital under the influence of pain killers about 4 years ago ......(disclaimer)
the content was thoroughly researched and will be the basis of the next two blogs I write called 'The good touch' I will do my best to leave 'no stone unturned' in my presentation....stay tuned

_________________
FEARS Ltd
"Art meets Reality"
www.fearsltd.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 4:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
:)

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 9:13 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:48 am
Posts: 501
kyusho is just anatomy and targeting , except all the magical waffle they mix in

better of buying an anatomy book

and listening to the old timers talk about where to hit

the truth is its never been as much about where to hit as having the ability to hit while stopping them hitting you , after you've conquered that dialling it down makes sense targeting makes sense.

and we all know were the ouchie points are .. we all hurt in the same places.

every playground in the world educates this.

but the moving folks with your mind the mystical .... try it while a real threat is trying to push your head in ....

as well as ... never instead of or it just wont work


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 9:40 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
Good comments Marcus, and these are the questions most people ask and wonder about.

My great student, Jim Hulse of England, has done a great job of a deep study of anatomical KO points as they relate to Uechi kata, and he is able to show how it all comes together for a KO...

But Jim is not a 'tapper' just about any body parts want to lay down and 'rest' if Jim slugs it... 8O

Image

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Kyusho Uncovered
PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 2:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 30858
Hi Robb,

This is a good article that I like on 'compounding' training and reality methods...I'd like to get your opinion on it...have you tried working this with your Kyusho partner?

http://www.kyusho.com/compounding/?fb_r ... ce=message


Quote:
Once the basics are understood (I mean really well), then you will naturally tend to compound the basics into a natural ability. If forced it will be non functional under real stress and conflict, so do not push the process, let it occur.

When you repeatedly apply the basic components like actually being able to hit a target under increased and spontaneous stress and attack, then you may want to add another component to that ability. As an example say you can target the mental nerve of the chin well under fast, spontaneously and affectively, then and only then should you begin to include compounded applicational measures.

This may be another target prior, depleting the “Iron Shirt” affect, or even sound.

The problem occurs for most when they try to do too much too soon and get nothing from those efforts. Sound for example will not make any difference if you do not apply it at the correct time and on target… so if you can not get to a target sound will not matter.

This is why a continuously challenging and added to methodology is critical to your approach, if you work your Kyusho in techniques or bunkai, this will help you realize this potential only if the attacker attacks you as practiced… rather impractical and give the user a false sense of security.

Doubling Kyusho attacks is one such measure that although workable in stationary application or even pre-planned and practiced technique/s, indeed will increase the affect and potential.

However if you then believe you can accomplish this with sudden, aggressive and fast action or even multiple attack you are in for quite a shock. In fact any pre-planned idea will play out this exact same way.

We recommend high paced action type training with the correct tools (one of our suggested methods for compounding) as it is more easily and efficiently compounded to your achievable target easily. This will compound the affect within the same action and with sustained and ever adapting need. It will become subconscious and a true internal or internalized skill.

The key is still simplicity… as anything gets more complex, it’s dependability as strength diminish… it becomes more a part of the conscious mind rather than the subconscious mind.

And let’s also understand that the conscious mind is a process that can accept and filter a few bit’s of information at any given time, whereas the subconscious mind can filter millions of bits of information simultaneously.

Just as a mother instantly picks up the distress cry of her child in a playground filled with screaming excited and distressful calls continuously… the mothers subconscious filters this out of the millions of sights, sounds, conversations, environmental and a myriad of additional occurrences and disturbances to hear and instinctively respond to that sole bit of information.

It is also her subconscious that allows her to take a direct path right to the child, even through a complex barrage of other stimulus.

Kyusho is an internal art, to work it externally or consciously is a recipe for failure, then to add the extra components will not make in any better, just more complex.


My question here to you, Robb, is this: You are a great fighter, well conditioned [iron shirt]...given this explanation in the article...can you set up a demo with a Kyusho expert in the methodology outlined in the article...so we could see if you could be knocked out in a full contact match?

You could try and set this up for the upcoming summer camp.

Again, it is not my intent to disparage anything written in the article, I like it, but I would like to see it demonstrated against non compliance, a powerful iron shirted individual and under an adrenaline dump which would be triggered if the two people squaring off know one of them will be knocked out in the exchange.

_________________
Van


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 26 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group