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 Post subject: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2011 3:11 am 
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New kata GIKEN of Uechi Ryu Kenseikai Sensei Yoshitsune Senaga
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pxxiyctzr4M

Very nice. :)

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2011 12:22 pm 
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niiiice

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Tue May 03, 2011 3:39 am 
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Thanks Van,

My first time seeing this…. I’m a huge fan of the speed, power and explosiveness of the non-teaching interpretation. Something Sensei Maloney challenges his advanced students to explore and experiment with religiously as you know and have witnessed….

Have to watch more but that is my initial impression for all its worth…. Looks like we may be having some fun in the future….very, very nice. :twisted:

Thanks sharing….

Shane.


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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Tue May 03, 2011 1:00 pm 
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Glad you like it. :D

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2011 5:53 pm 
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In learning this kata, one thing I notice is how effortless master Senaga makes the "double-block+mawashi uke+boshiken tsuki" sequences look near the end. It's not hard to do these one step at a time, as in the teaching segment of the video, but making them flow at full speed is going to take me thousands of repetitions. Fun stuff. Nice break from trying to teach myself Suparempi from Bill's video (that effort is progressing slowly).

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2011 1:34 am 
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Now this is not a criticism of the kata, I actually think the kata is cool. But one of the reasons I love Uechi ryu is the simplicity, the fact there are only 8 kata. So when I see this kata I can't help but think, "nice kata but it's just the same movements seen in other uechi kata but in a different series. " So I have to ask would time be better spent learning different bunkai for the kata we have? Maybe we need to spend more time thinking outside the box with the kata we already practice instead of doing the same bunkai and feeling you have to create a new kata to express yourself?


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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2011 2:15 am 
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The guy that has done 10,000,000 different kicks doesn't scare me... The guy that did 1 kick 10,000,000 times, and the last million was to the exact same place does scare the heck out of me... :P

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2011 5:39 pm 
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PaulC wrote:
So when I see this kata I can't help but think, "nice kata but it's just the same movements seen in other uechi kata but in a different series. "


For the most part, but not quite. I note 4 moves that are not present in Uechi kata, though one appears in kumite, complete on only one side and in only one instance. I find some value-added there. Kata teaches gross motor movements without necessarily making it clear what they are for. It's one piece of the training puzzle, one of those that you can do without a partner.

As to what would be more valuable considering what we already have and what we arguably lack, I agree with you. I'd really like to see bunkai that made me think, "Yeah, those attacks and defenses are the real deal, and that might really happen in a fight, just like that." However, I don't tend to view these things as "zero sum" matters. We have not been given this instead of that. We have been given this, and that is that.

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2011 6:23 pm 
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PaulC wrote:
Now this is not a criticism of the kata, I actually think the kata is cool. But one of the reasons I love Uechi ryu is the simplicity, the fact there are only 8 kata. So when I see this kata I can't help but think, "nice kata but it's just the same movements seen in other uechi kata but in a different series. " So I have to ask would time be better spent learning different bunkai for the kata we have? Maybe we need to spend more time thinking outside the box with the kata we already practice instead of doing the same bunkai and feeling you have to create a new kata to express yourself?


I agree. I believe you and I may have trained together at Walter Mattson's dojo in the 90's and heard Walter describe the kata as a "narrow but deep study." Kata has tremendous training benefit but I believe bunkai is where its at in terms of what we do. More bunkai for what we currently have also makes sense to me. Kata is great but the question I ask myself is "can I make this kata work?" I find as time goes on I tend to continue to find many applications in the kata we have that weren't there before. I hope this continues for me.


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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 1:31 am 
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Yes I did study under Walter and very much remember that statement. I always thought it described Uechi perfectly. I unfortunately don't recognize your handle and applaude you for recognizing mine. I haven't been to Walters classes for several years, ever since blowing my knee out having kids and moving, all around the same year. I called it the perfect storm of excuses for not going to class. Though I have been studying under Bob Spoon in Beverly for the past couple of years. He also has a similar belief in the narrow but deep philosophy.


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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 6:31 pm 
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While the statement ''A narrow study then deep is true its more complete with the element of breadth contained within the triad .
If some one is not at the level of breadth ,there are no options yet ,so more application of whats already present becomes the norm ,yet there is expansion within this format ,along with a deepening .
A new kata provides for the practioner if its not moribund in that it it breaks free from known and extends the principles of Sanchin in avenues that broaden that narrowness .

Max.

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 1:21 am 
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Freakin Shakespearean Maxwell!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 1:24 am 
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I'll put it a differnet way... Yoshitune Senaga Sensei will beat most great men to a pulp... Forget about over analyzing.... Learn from what he is doing!!! He is great!!!

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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 1:44 pm 
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Other then the outward strike in the beginning I don’t see any techniques that can’t be interpreted from the kata we already have. Now that doesn’t mean Yoshitune Senaga Sensei wouldn’t have applications that he feels are not properly represented in the bunkai associated to the existing kata. With those new interpretations may come a slight variation in the technique but that doesn’t mean it’s a new technique just a different application. And in my opinion, which isn’t worth much, those slight variations don’t require a new kata but rather a new bunkai.


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 Post subject: Re: New Uechi Kata
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 6:09 pm 
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While it is perhaps a valid philosophical point that everything can be interpreted as already existing in some sense, I usually prefer a more simple view, that if it feels natural, either it actually is natural or I've trained for it. If it feels awkward, it is neither natural nor something that I've been properly trained for, and in that case it doesn't matter much to me if it exists in some interpreted, philosophical, or piece-by-piece sense in what I already know. As far as creative bunkai goes, I very much prefer if bunkai sticks close enough to the kata that one feels as if the basic motions of the bunkai are really trained for by performing the kata, not simply resembling them at some other level.

Maybe it is only a sign of my own deficiencies, but as I learned this kata and as I continue practice it from time to time, I do sense reducing awkwardness and that I am training my body to move more effectively in certain, coordinated ways, not so very different from when I learned to coordinate the check block with mawashi-uke years ago, or get both hands doing the right things at the right times in watari-uke. Obviously I could always do what I wanted with either hand, but at first it felt like I didn't know how to walk and chew gum at the same time.

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