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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 2:06 am 
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Mike,

Thanks for a most comprehensive introspective post.

In reading it…I am reminded by Introspection as the activity described by Plato when he asked, "…why should we not calmly and patiently review our own thoughts, and thoroughly examine and see what these appearances in us really are?"

There is enough in your post to keep this discussion going forever.

As to the indoctrination of 'emergent property' giving us an edge in time of need performance wise …I agree. However when we talk 'combat effectiveness' we must measure it against the nature of the enemy and the situational exposure of the event.

So I think in terms of 'combat effectiveness' …but against whom and what?

The truth is that most of us, regardless of the type of training … can only be expected in reality to be 'combat effective' under a limited paradigm...i.e., a philosophical or theoretical framework of any kind.

The intelligent practitioner will grasp the meaning of what I write; many others will completely miss the point.

Rory excels in bringing these concepts forcefully home in his two books 'meditations on violence' and' facing violence' which most martial arts practitioners will never read as they'll topple the pedestal under their feet.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 2:24 am 
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Quote:
I don't accept what Rory says without question, either, but he is definitely not asking me to.


Rory understands that there are no absolutes. We may do what Rory indoctrinates with a more complete understanding of the dynamics of violence…then again we may not and just stand there frozen or be overcome by bad luck.

The gospel truth being that nearly every "martial artist" screws
up! It is the human condition regardless of any dojo 'warriorship' _
Quote:
I don't know if knowing better what to expect will even help me when I need it. I don't even know whether reality is, on average, preferable to fantasy. Most people will never experience real violence, particularly if they avoid high-risk environments, so for them it may be just as well to believe whatever they like.


Best way I have ever seen it put.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 2:37 am 
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I don't worry about 50 year-old karate teachers very much, even though I think you're right that, absent at least an intuitive grasp of the information in Facing Violence, they are at risk variously for seriously hurting somebody who doesn't need it or not pressing the go button when their life depends on it.

I don't see where those insights about when to press the go button and how much force to use are encoded in Sanchin
.

Also they are at risk of making some serious tactical blunders including the belief in their 'confidence' to take on any adversary because of their sanchin and end up being lowered into a hole in the ground with family and friends using their collection of belts as casket straps.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 2:40 am 
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BTW, I don't know if you got an email for every edit I made to this post. In fact I got in a kind of loop where I would submit it, read it back, and then decide I didn't like part of it. I think it says what I want it to say now. )


:D No I didn't get them...and you have done a great job in your post.

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