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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2014 6:29 pm 
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The thing about big guys is that sometimes they were the little guy until they hit puberty,and they still have a small guy mind. Same as little guys sometimes they were the big guy until they were 15 or so, then everybody outgrew them, but they still have the big tough guy mind :lol: ........if you know this, it helps, look at the big guys eyes, some people really don't want to be confrontational. I've known some really big guys pushing 7 foot and 300 lb plus and generally they never have to fight.................got to ask yourself why a 7 foot guy needs karate, they don't, it's either art ,exercise or fear 8)..and fear is because they were a little guy until puberty kicked in.


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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 4:48 am 
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Watch this street beating and how the first punch was thrown.

http://www.theminorityreportblog.com/20 ... -lifetime/

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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 5:27 am 
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Stupid is as stupid does ........


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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 3:09 pm 
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Stupid jerk for sure, and a number of lessons to be learned by the video.

1. Any of us can come up against such people in our everyday activities; they seem to spring up like mushrooms.

2. Notice how the punk attacks by charging forward and throwing a combination left jab/right overhead, something we should be practicing to neutralize in the dojo instead of the usual straight karate punches attacks.

3. Notice how quickly the fight goes to the ground, as most fights will on the street.

4. Notice how difficult it is for the punk, as it will be for anyone, when up against someone with great bulk and weight, having the advantage of strength and momentum.

5. Notice how easy it is to get your head beaten in, once you are on the ground…and the punk is lucky not to have has his head stomped on after the punch-out.

~~

This is the reason why we in Uechi should focus more on the sidestep/tenshin/ getting off line practice…something that is built in into our kata.

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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:41 am 
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great points Van

seems the only time I deal with straight punches (apart from jabs) is karate demonstrations .... curves are faster and harder ... enough said ..... :twisted: :lol: :P

thank god I do a circular style like uechi !!!!

you need some ground skills , its not hard to outclass the average guy on the ground with just a little knowledge , all that karate skill is just as useful on the ground if you have a platform , if you have no positional skill on the ground , well all that stand up work is useless , think practicing karate without having/developing balance .....

ps your take downs and closing takes on another dimension when the fear of the ground and transitioning between is just another skillset.


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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:44 am 
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Stryke
Quote:
seems the only time I deal with straight punches (apart from jabs) is karate demonstrations .... curves are faster and harder ... enough said ..... :twisted: :lol: :P


You kind of wander why people don't get this...maybe it has to do with the fact that most have never been in a real fight or even sparred in competition against...say a good TKD man with killer 'curve kicks' _

On the street it is very possible to come against some punk who loves to street fight, like the turd in the video, and one who has some experience in throwing good punches, such as the hooks to the body and or the sides of your face.

Then again, in a street fight we will see crazy wild punches raining from everywhere, not so easy to deal with, especially if never practiced in the dojo.

I have two students who were boxers, one trained under Petronelli, Mike.

Quote:
Guerino "Goody" Petronelli (12 October 1923 – 29 January 2012) was an American boxing trainer and co-manager.

With his brother Pasquale (Pat), Petronelli managed and trained world middleweight champion Marvin Hagler. His other fighters included Robbie Sims, Steve Collins, and Kevin McBride. In 1983, the Petronellis received The Al Buck Award for Manager of the Year by the International Boxing Hall of Fame.


Granted that the average street punk or opponent you may meet won't have the same type of training, but never underestimate anyone and his ability to punch you in ways you don't train to deal with.

Mike gives a sobering demonstration of punching power, speed and targeting.

His punches are so fast that they are hard to see much less 'block'_

When he goes for your face he doesn't go directly in but comes in at a slight angle where he pummels the cheek bones or jaw line first, moving in towards the nose, maximizing damage and minimizing the risk to his hands.

But even Mike, now prefers open hand/forearm strikes to the throat and the sides of the neck , close to the carotid artery, which will disrupt the assailant's breathing or cut circulation to the brain. He knows how easy it is to break your hands no matter what the 'conditioning'_

But the most 'scary' punches Mike throws, if he gets within range, are brutal hooks to the liver with his left and under the heart with his right, crushing the ribs _ working his way to the kidneys.

To see those punches land on 'poor Bob' and to imagine yourself getting hit, is pretty sobering, knowing that we don't train to even familiarize with those punches.

A liver shot is a sure KO for example.
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A liver punch is usually made with the left hand, or the left hook in infighting, or the regular short body hook, in a short and quick manner. The drive is usually made under and to the front of the ninth and tenth ribs upward to the base of the shoulder blade toward the spine. The punch shocks the liver, the largest gland organ, and a center of blood circulation, and causes the victim to lose focus and drive, if not to lose consciousness outright, and can cause a breathless feeling in the victim.


As trained by Petronelli_ Mike uses the hips to maximize power...he rolls the hips into the punch which forces the shoulder to support the punch and engages the core causing more torque.

Coming up against those kind of punches on the street can be very scary and dangerous for any of us.

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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:28 am 
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Wow.... The Marvin Haggler?

Marvelous Marvin Haggler VS Thomas the Hitman Hearns

Just a furious great fight


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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 6:23 pm 
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Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
“Notice how quickly the fight goes to the ground, as most fights will on the street.”

Nothing new to say but sometimes it is good to say it:

Most (but not all) fights start standing. This is the best place to end them.
The fight will most often go to the ground when two not so skilled people clash and struggle in a clinch.
The fight will go to the ground when the more skilled person wants it there.
The fight will go to the ground often due to ambush and that is where the bad guy wants it, because it is an ambush there is often no way to stop it going there.

Because of this everyone should know how to fight on the ground.
Learn takedown defence. To do this you need to learn takedowns or you are simply imagining how they might do it to you and how you might defend it. (Sort of like those teaching knife defence but not training to use a knife.)
Learn to fight from the clinch.
Learn to grapple standing and on the ground.
Do not forget we are a combination of striking and grappling in Uechi with a lot of emphasise on striking SO learn to strike from and on the ground. I did a session in Nova Scotia on this and the Uechi people took to it immediately. For too long the big lie that you cannot strike while on the ground has been bought as truth.
Remember this is an assault not a BJJ tournament so ground fight not ground grapple. (Note - if you do not know how to ground grapple and the other guy does you may forever wonder how he broke your arm – assuming you are not choked out and then head stomped.
Remember the tiger of Uechi is for ripping and tearing .

Always work to get back to your feet because it doesn’t matter how well you are doing on the ground if the guy getting beaten has more friends standing and watching because they will not watch for long before kicking you in the head.

And let’s not forget the clip posted here of the fight outside the football stadium where the one guys snuck around slipping in to head stomp and run.

The ground is not a place to be but it is a place you may well be.

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Rick Wilson - http://wpd-rc.com/


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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 10:05 pm 
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Great post Rick, thanks.

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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:26 pm 
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“Notice how quickly the fight goes to the ground, as most fights will on the street.”

I disagree with this and would say that most fights are standing up affairs and generally end very quickly with one or two blows.
This one went to the ground because that was the white guys game plan, and it looked like he had done it before, maybe some mma classes or at least a fanboy, he got away with it because he had his buddy watching over him

The white guy wasn't a bad fighter, it depends on how you evaluate someone's ability, I'd say that the black guy looked like he'd done a bit of competition karate by the way he moved.maybe they hadn't done either, who knows. I learnt some nasty moves from old jiu jitsu which was basically ripping and tearing.you don't see many people using them though


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 Post subject: Re: Move or die
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:55 am 
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Fights do end on the ground very often. The reason why it is a good idea to learn some good grappling moves.

Never assume that whatever fight you find yourself in will be a stand up affair.
Quote:
In other words, there is more than a good chance that if two people fight, one of them is going to end up on the ground (72% in this study). The chance that both will end up there is much less (42% in this study), but it is still substantial enough that one should focus on ground defense.

The third research question that needed to be answered is how do those fighters end up on the ground? The answer to that query is that in our study, 57% of the fighters who ended up on the ground were taken down by a throw, a trip or being pulled to the ground. Being pushed only accounted for 7% of fighters who ended up on the ground. So learning how to grapple and more specifically; how to apply and stop takedowns is vital to fighting.

The other most common way that fighters ended up on the ground was by being punched. This accounted for 35% of the total incidents where a fighter was sent to the ground.

One other important point is for martial artists or others who might rely on kicking techniques. Out of 300 analyzed fights and 600 fighters, only one person fell to the ground because of a kick. However, that kick did result in a knockout of the person on the receiving end.

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