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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 1998 3:00 am 
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Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 2075
Location: Boston, MA
Reading Van sensei's "primal instinct" thread, I was reminded of different writers/marital artist who share much of the same perspectives on mindset and training. I'll list them out, in no particular order, in case people are interested in reading any of them:

Don Pentecost: Put 'Em Down, Take 'Em Out - Knife Fighting Techniques from Folsom Prison.

William Cassidy: Knife Fighting

Eugene Sockut: Secrets of street self-defense - ISRAELI STYLE

Mark Wiley: Filipino Martial Arts (which profiles Flipino masters/warriors and their varied perspectives)

Peyton Quinn: Real Fighting (by now, everyone's read him)

Marc Animal MacYoung: any title (except, perhaps, "Knife Fighting")

Jack Sabat: Zen and the Art of Streetfighting
(Hard to say if this guy's for real)

Bruce Lee: The Tao of Jeet Kune Do (a lot of philosophy sprinkled with, in my opinion, good advice)

Eiji Yoshikawa: Musashi (heck, this is fiction, but fun fiction)

?Author: Bloody Iron (I am looking for this book. Does anyone have a copy?)

Charles Kelly Yeaton: The First Commando Knives (bits and pieces are interesting about mindsets of Fairbairn, Yeaton, Sykes, Taxis, Applegate).

I didn't agree wholeheartedly with any one of the above authors. A lot rang true. Certainly, each gave much to ponder about "realistic" training.

david


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 1998 5:38 am 
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Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 148
Location: Boca Raton, FL
David,

I read Jack Sabat's "Zen And The Art Of Streetfighting." This guy is definitely a few quarts short of a full load. I was so disappointed with the book that I brought it back and got a refund.

Their training facilities were quite remarkable though - remember? Full contact sparring matches in small, confined areas usually comprised of four steel walls/bulkheads and oil and water covered floors (they were on board naval warships). I think the guy became a "professional" wrestler.

My recommendation - save your money for something more useful.

Moe


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 1998 11:56 am 
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Location: Boston, MA
Moe,

Like I said, I don't wholeheartedly agree with any of the authors... <g>

I think Sabat is over the top. I found him disturbing and at the same time fascinating. The latter because I have met a few people here and there like him.

Actually, Van sensei graciously joined some of us for coffee after class last week and the conversations were interesting. We briefly discussed a instructor we both knew, whose teaching/training methods were(are) rather "extreme" in our opinions. This conversation reminded me of Sabat. Undoutably such extreme mindset and training will produce good fighters, though the cost is high with injuries and attrition of students.

Also, at one point, Sabat talked about "sparring matches" with some visitors in his dojo. That also reminded me of some of the "matches" we had in the earlier days of the Hancock dojo. So, there were bits and pieces of Sabat's book that had an "oh, yeah..." quality to it. (BTW, Sabat's book HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ZEN, in case anyone is looking for a discussion on that topic.)

A correction: I meant to list Wiley's "Fillipino Martial Culture" and not "Fillipino Martial Art". The latter deals specifically with Cabales Serrada Escrima. The first book was interesting in presenting some of the living Fillipino masters from the WWII generation (i.e. they've been there, done that.) Cabales was one of the people presented. Cabales, among some of the others, fought death matches as a youth. I would say that requires a certain mindset.

Also, Wes Tasker met and trained with some of those masters and/or instructors from certain lineages. He will attest to a certain "mindset" of some of those folks.

I think each author presents something about a mindset that is needed for "combat" and the various training methods that might get you there. The "price" can be high, I think, physically and psychologically. Each of us has to figure out the limits we are willing to go to prepare ourselves for the "real thing".

Anthony:

Thanks for the link!


david


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 1998 6:49 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 24, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 311
Location: Washington DC area, USA
Does anyone think that meditation or meditating would help mindset??


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 1998 8:10 pm 
Cecil,
I think there are ways, some very much like certain meditation techniques that can help to program your mind for certain reactions. I think one would have to be careful not to just fantasize and fool oneself into thinking one was actually doing something, and there are other methods that would have to be used as well. If you know a good method of 'reprogramming ' and can do it efficiently, I think it might be worthwhile. I'm sure others who are more experienced will have more valuable opinions on this.

[This message has been edited by maurice richard libby (edited 09-24-98).]

[This message has been edited by maurice richard libby (edited 09-24-98).]


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 1998 12:49 am 
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Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 2075
Location: Boston, MA
Cecil,

If you were to believe the writings and stories of some of Japan's renown warriors, then, yes, meditation can help with "mindset".

Their "mindset" was/is different than drawing on righteous anger. Rather, it transcends anger, fear of any other emotion. The mindset (in this case, I rather use the term, "mind state", because of its "flexibility") is to see clearly what has to be done and to do it. If what has to be done is to kill the enemy, so be it. So be it as well if what one has to do is to strip down to the naval and perform seppeku.

I sure would not want to put myself anywhere near the level of those warriors. Meditation doesn't help me with my "mindset". However, it helps me see when it is not appropriate and/or to get over it more quickly. Meditation helps me see more clearly what's going on, independent of my emotions. At least, this is what I believe...


david



[This message has been edited by david (edited 09-24-98).]


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