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PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2000 3:07 pm 
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Joined: Fri Apr 30, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 1184
Location: Newton, MA
Sensei Murphy,
Please email me. I have some information for you (blacksteel@aol.com)

Jake Steinmann

Defeat is worse than death. You have to live with defeat - Seal Team Slogan

[This message has been edited by Jake Steinmann (edited August 14, 2000).]

PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2000 6:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 17, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 2811
Location: Massachusetts
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by MANNAVARAYAN:

Fact is only 20% of the so called hidden techniques would actually help in a self-defense situation and even then sometimes not often.

Ex in goju ry: an empai zuke(elbow strike) in the kata seienchin might work in a situation where a person is grabbing you by both hands around your waist,sleeve or collor area but would not work if pinned against the wall by some one grabbing you at throat or arms pinned against the wall.

Empi zuke in this kata would be the only technique if you're lucky that work all the rest is crap.

In sanseiru the grabbing under the leg and breaking with palm of other hand might work in real situation but the rest of techniques in that kata is pointless.

In shi sho shin only technique that would work is the busting of the elbow.

My point is every kata does have hidden movements,but only 1 useful technique per kata.

All the stances mean crap in a real situation.

(snip for brevity)

I speak from experience,I did Goju Ryu and Meibu-kan goju for 12yrs.and was always told that the hidden techniques in each kata are those of self-defense and have been proven to work and that it's the way our masters do it.

(more snippage)

Wake up,traditional arts are nothing more than a bunch of made up moves done in specific orders just as in dancing.

(even more snippage)

If you study the typical traditional arts assuming the movements within the katas can actually save your butt in a real situation,then I have one thing to say"you are totally mistaken,infact it can get you killed"

Practicing everday something you think has potential for a defense move and believe in it truly will be trouble when you really need back up most.Very few movements in karate or other traditional arts will actually do any good,if any at and if one or two safe your life,you are lucky.These chances are very low though.

(yet even more snippage)

I know many traditionalist are probably pissed off before they even reach this part of the page even though I'm only giving my opinion and professional experience as a martial artist myself.I've studied martial arts for 14yrs.now and have learnt to recognize what is realistic and what isn't.


Thanks, that's pretty good! Image Not pissed off at all... really needed that. I don't know what your "professional" experience is... Did you own/operate a dojo? Member the PKL or PKA or some other group for ranked tournament competitors? Most of the "traditionalists" that I know and care about wouldn't call themselves "professional" at least in the sense that they make their living solely off of the art. They would call themselves "professional" in how they conduct themselves, but that's just a general term that doesn't seem to fit your usage... IMNSHO.

IF you've only found one useful technique in Seiyunchin, Sanseiru, Shishochin or any of the other goju-ryu kata, then (again, this is just MNSHO) perhaps more time with the kata is in order!

I can say unequivocally that there is more than one technique (per kata) in the goju-ryu kata that can be used in a real world(tm) self-defense situation and that will save one's life. I'm here because the various techniques in kara-te and ju-jitsu do work... I've disproven your opinion that it "can get you killed" personally... on the street.

So, you'll forgive my "limited" experience and my mistaken belief that proper stances are important and these principles work.

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