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 Post subject: 36 thows, 72 joint locks
PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2000 4:10 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 391
"The word Gung fu includes techniques of hands, knees, elbows, shoulders, head, and thighs, the thirty-six throws, the seventy-two joint locks, and the eighteen different weapons...."
From Bruce Lee's "Jeet Kune Do".

Can anybody comment on the thirty-six throws and/or the seventy-two joint locks of Chinese Gung fu that Lee was referring to? I have heard these numbers mentioned by other Chinese and Okinawan martial artists, but have never seen them codified and explained like the Japanese systems. Are these techniques basicly the same as those found in Jujitsu, Judo, and Aikido?

How many of these techniques are found in Uechi-ryu? Anybody know how many are found in the other Okinawan styles? How do you spot these techniques in kata? Once you spot them, how do you go about training them with a partner?

Thanks.

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"There ain't no graduation from this kind of education"


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 Post subject: 36 thows, 72 joint locks
PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2000 4:28 pm 
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Joined: Fri Apr 30, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 1185
Location: Newton, MA
Hmm...interesting question:

Northern Eagle Claw teaches 108 joint locking techniques (Chin Na). Some of them look like Aikido, Judo or Jujitsu locks. Some of them don't. They are codified pretty well (or so I'm told).

Never heard of 36 throws and 72 joint locks...though that does add up to 108, so it might be reference to the same thing. I cannot, off the top of my head, remember how much familiarity Lee had with Eagle Claw.

The problem with discussing "Kung Fu" in general terms is that there are so many styles out there. It might help if Lee had been more specific (of course, we can't ask him now, can we?).

Finding them? Be creative with your movements...try doing them against a variety of attacks (slowly!) and see what happens.

Practicing it? Same way you practice everything else, I'd warrant. Get a partner and work it.

No idea how many of these are in Uechi or any other okinowan forms. As most Uechi-ka train...none. But that's another can of worms.




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 Post subject: 36 thows, 72 joint locks
PostPosted: Sun Sep 03, 2000 9:15 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 268
Thirty- six throws and seventy-two jointlocks? Naw, doesn't ring any bells here.

What there are, in Shuai Chiao, Chinese Wrestling, are supposed to be about three hundred and sixty-some throws, ina recent book by a Chinese martialartist, seventy-five of those are given as adapted to free finghting(Linag, Shou-Yu, Chinese Fast Wrestling For Fee Fighting.0

Judo has the forty throws, go kyo, plus shimmeisho no waza, newer throws, coming toabut fifty-seven, not counting a bunch more in kata like Koshiki No Kata, said to contain the entire throwing repertoire of Kito Ryu Jujitsu, and all done as if both participants are in heavy wooden armor.

There are supposed to be thirty-six Shaolin Death Points, points struck so as to cause fatality in one shot, and seventy two that cause other effects in martial use, there's that 108 again, but thirty six throws? Lots more than that everywhere, and seventy-two jointlocks? More than that, Chinese arts list about seven hundred, usually teaching as Jake mentions of Eagle Claw, around 108, that's a Buddhist thing I think.

So, I think, this statement must be discounted, as there are far more techniques than that in each category in almost every art that has them.

Interestingly enough, however, Aiki do and Chin Na both have seven fundamental techniques teaching the basic principles of their arts, but they are different techniques, not the same.

Stuff just isn't cut and dried as one might wish.

Also in Judo , there are five categoris or teachingds(kyo) of eight throws each, which each have a diferent principle, as hand techniques, leg throws, hip throws, and so on.

But when you count possible variations on each theme, they are far more than eight in each cateory.

So, I don't think there are common syllabi for the various grappling arts.

But I hope this helps.

Kusanku


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