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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Mon Oct 23, 2000 7:33 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 76
Location: Los Angeles, Ca
All I know is,
Aikido:
I like it! Image
-Meta

------------------


If you overlook the Way right before your
eyes, how will you know the path beneath
your feet? Advancing has nothing to do with
near and far, yet delusion creates obstacles
high and wide. Students of the mystery, I
humbly urge you, don't waste a moment, night
or day!

- Shih-t'ou (700-790)


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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2000 2:01 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 16, 1999 6:01 am
Posts: 1476
Location: Halifax, NS Canada
Rich-san...a while back I posted something on Jackie Olsen's forum about "Angry White Pajamas". I loved that book! My thread was entitled "Breaking the Mirror" in reference to the ceremony mentioned in the book. An enjoyable read... :-)


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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2000 7:05 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 17, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 2813
Location: Massachusetts
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by david:

There is also a style, Hakkori ryu Aikijujutsu, that doesn't relate back to the Takeda lineage. The US rep is sensei/shihan Columbo out in (?) colorado. Columbo has several books out and was discussed/presented in Forrest Morgan's book, Living the Martial Way.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by kenkyusha:

Actually, the founder of Hakkoryu was a student of Takeda Sokaku. He attained the rank of Kyoju Dairi, then split off. He was also a contemporary of noted Shiatsu exponent Namikoshi (forget his first name), but formulated Koho Igaku (imperial method) of Shiatsu to be taught along with the Hakko-ryu.

(snip)

Was this instructor out in central Massachussets? If so, those guys like to train pretty hard, so it wasn't just you (they knock each other around like that regularly).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The overall U.S. Representative for hakko-ryu ju-jitsu was Dennis Palumbo - Shihan Menkyo Kaiden San Dai Kichu. He wrote a number of books on the art that are very good. As with most martial arts, they are only a supplement and not a replacement of proper study and training under a sensei of the art.

The Soke of Hakko-ryu was Ryuho* (Yoshiharu) Okuyama. Okuyama was more than just a student of Sokaku Takeda, the headmaster of Daito-ryu at the time, he was Takeda's uchideshi (special desciple). Okuyama's first professional studies were in law and politics, but he was truly interested in medicine and the martial arts. He studied TCM (accupuncture & moxibustion) with Hirata Ryozan in Asahigawa and his research led to the development of "Koho Igaku Shiatsu" (Imperial Finger Pressure) masssage therapy for health and well-being.

His martial arts training was equally indepth and he studied many different styles (Daito-ryu, Takenouchi Ryu, Kito Ryu, Tenshin Shinyo Ryu, and a complete repertoire of weapons). He even became a Shugendo priest... (these philosophies are only taught to the higher practitioners of the art). When he was asked to give a MA demonstration in 1938, he combined his various martial arts knowledge with his medical knowledge and called the resulting art "Shido Yottsu me Do". He officially had his art recognized by the Japanese authorities in 1941 and named it "Hakko-ryu" (school of the eight lights) ju-jitsu. He was also a writer and a calligrapher who's pen-name "Ryuho" means "spine of the dragon". His son still teaches at the Hombu in Japan and has also taken the name "Ryuho" since his Sho Dai Soke passed away in 1987. His son (Toshio - Ni Dai Soke "Ryuho" Okuyama) is now head of the system and teaches nearly every day.

There are a number of different "aiki-jutsu" practitioners in central Massachusetts who claim ties to Hakko-ryu. Some are even (sort of) legitimate... I am also interested in who this person was that you worked out with, but I think I have it narrowed down to a few possibilities. If you can let us know more, I'll give any information I can.


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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2000 6:04 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 35
Location: Cambridge, MA USA
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Panther:
There are a number of different "aiki-jutsu" practitioners in central Massachusetts who claim ties to Hakko-ryu. Some are even (sort of) legitimate... I am also interested in who this person was that you worked out with, but I think I have it narrowed down to a few possibilities. If you can let us know more, I'll give any information I can.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Hello Panther-san,

Actually, the person that I am talking about is connected to a legitmate school of Daito-ryu through a well known instructor. They do train very vigorously, and have a reputation for going through a bunch of 'interested' folks, but they are not (in any way, shape or form to my knowledge) affiliated with or claiming connection to Hakkoryu.

Be well,
Jigme



------------------
Jigme Chobang
aikibudokai@yahoo.com


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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2000 2:55 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 17, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 2813
Location: Massachusetts
Thanks Jigme-san.

I was wondering also who David-san was referring to?


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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2000 3:42 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 2075
Location: Boston, MA
The person I was referring to is related to a daito-ryu group. I have not offered a name because -- to be blunt -- the person was being being egotistical and not just training hard. There is no excuse for continuous application of pressure when an uke is tapping. There is no reason to throw an uke in manner that precluded a safe breakfall, especially when said uke (me) was wearing a white belt, an indication of my relative inexperience in that arena. There also is just absolutely no excuse to hurt or come close to hurting an uke ("the receiver") who by definition, though varying in degree, is being compliant with the technique. Frankly, I found myself myself wanting to punch the guy out.

I left aikido for several reasons, one of which is egotistical folks who exploit the inherent cooperative nature of such workouts. I would have loved to have said to him, "try that with me in a freestyle workout -- full contact... I be more impressed then." But, alas, the aikido dojo, which was where we were training and he a "guest", doesn't allow for that method of technique validation...

david


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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2000 4:20 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 17, 2000 6:01 am
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Location: Massachusetts
David-san,

My point was that I used to know most of the ju-jitsu/aiki-jitsu dojo in central Massachusetts (Metro-west) areas. I was curious which dojo it was that allowed someone to be treated that way and also wondered (now answered) if it was done by an instructor for the school. I had/have a few thoughts on possibilities... just from working out at various places and knowing the egos that some folks had.


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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2000 4:49 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 2075
Location: Boston, MA
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote
Quote:
They do train very vigorously, and have a reputation for going through a bunch of 'interested' folks, but they are not (in any way, shape or form to my knowledge) affiliated with or claiming connection to Hakkoryu.


Jigme, Panther and others,

We are digressing from the original topic. But have to say, if that that is a true observation about a certain group of daito ryu practitioners, then I would have to say that is a bunch of SAD "martial artists." Any number of us on these forums, can "go through a bunch of 'interested' folks." But, what's the point of that, if we supposedly trying to train/teach them?

GRrrrrr.... I am finding that streetcorner mentality rising in me. All I can say is C'mon down and boogey, Baby! We'll dance the mangle tangle.

david


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 Post subject: aikido or akijutsu
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2000 6:50 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 05, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 989
Location: Randolph, MA USA 781-963-8891
Folks,

I agree with David. Please keep on track as this conversation has been extremely rivoting. Let's keep away from trashing anyone if we can help it.

Thanks guys,

mike


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