How Gun Controllers Mislead and, well, LIE

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IJ
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Post by IJ »

I'm suggesting that the problem with the article is that it's as much as a distortion and a lie than that it claimed to be exposing. I think we should distrust people who do this regardless of what their position is or whether we happen to endorse it. I think the writer should have gone after MMM with all of the legitimate arguments that are easy to employ against it. By failing to do this the writer comes off not just as biased, but also as having questionable insight on the issue.
--Ian
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Panther
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Post by Panther »

That's all well and good of you to say...

But here's why I think there appears to be a problem...

Here, the minute someone posts a link to something that discusses the lies and distortions of the gun grabbers, you jump right in and start picking apart why there are problems with the article written against the gun grabbers. While those points may or may not be valid, it does make people wonder when in another thread about the provable lies and deceptions of a gun grabber, who is a self-professed "ultra-liberal", the only complaint you had was because someone quoted Michael Savage who has stated that Ultra-liberalism is a mental illness! Not one bit of being upset at the lies and deceptions of Michael Moore from you... not a hint that you considered his deception reprehensible.

Now, it may or may not be true, but the appearance is that you are quick to look the other way when it is a liberal gun grabber and quick to lodge a complaint when it is a conservative pointing out the liberal gun grabber's lies.

Just food for thought...
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IJ
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Post by IJ »

There are two reasons you are noticing this. The first is because Michael Moore is a performer, an entertainer and a self avowed hard core leftie. Fox, on the other hand, is decietful because it markets itself as "fair and balanced" when it actually has an organized conservative agenda. It's goal is to make the conservatives who are far to the right feel that yes, they're actually middle of the road and completely average philosophically and its those lefties who are off center! And to drive liberals crazy. For more on this I recommend Franken's book. He also is an entertainer, so I give him some leeway too. Is that not being fair? Well, I also view the verbal crimes of Rush Limbaugh in a FAR less serious way than those of George Bush. For the same reason: Rush is an entertainer, and while Bush is an actor, he is acting like the president but actually f--ing over the bulk of this country for the benefit of his millionaire buddies and to promote his off center agenda which I find repressive and meanspirited. So when Rush called Chelsea Clinton a dog when she was 13 or so, that made him a jerk, but he wasn't really participating in national "debate" at the time.

The second reason is that people write in when they feel they have something to ADD. I don't see the point of writing a 30th post on how Moore cut and pasted speech fragments to make the NRA look bad. Everyone knows that's dishonest and its already said. And frankly, there are dozens and dozens of conservative voices on these forums and only a few who speak up for liberal causes. You don't need me to bash Moore to even the playing field and I don't feel compelled to do so for my credentials. I'll either stand behind, retract, or apologize for my posts on their individual merits.

How many of your conservative posters have pointed out such flaws in conservative articles, BTW?

PS: did you note where I explained what I thought were the real faults with MMM?
--Ian
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Post by Panther »

IJ wrote:And frankly, there are dozens and dozens of conservative voices on these forums and only a few who speak up for liberal causes.
Frankly, over 85% of the people working in "mainstream" media are liberals. Perhaps your comment is accurate for this forum, but the vast majority of the people are middle of the road... Conservative on some issues and liberal on others, but the vast majority of those who control and report the "mainstream" news or control or work in the entertainment industry are ultra-liberals. So, with all of the liberal, antiAmerican drivel all over the mainstream news and in the mainstream media, you expect me to be sympathetic to your criticism of one of the very few quasi-conservative outlets? Don't hold your breath! If you want to be adoring to someone stroking the liberal ego, just turn to most media outlets besides the quasi-conservative FOX network! So this forum has plenty of conservative views posted, just consider it a little bit of resistance to the tyranny of the majority of the media and hollywood elite ultra-liberals!

And you totally blew any credibility in your arguments when you try to say that Al Franken's opinion is worth anything but wiping my @$$ with. He's a one-note samba... "All conservatives are stoopid, except those who are evil." I won't waste my time with his verbal diarrhea!
PS: did you note where I explained what I thought were the real faults with MMM?
Yeah, but did you consider that while you might disagree with that article, the MMM's own mission statement along with the speeches from the top supporters and organizers belies the TRUTH that they are trying to completely ban the private ownership of firearms? No, didn't think so...
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My God-given Rights are NOT "void where prohibited by law!"
IJ
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Post by IJ »

"Perhaps your comment is accurate for this forum, but the vast majority of the people are middle of the road."

Well, this is where I posted my comments, so they still seem appropriate. The liberal vs conservative bias to the news is potentially worth debating, but probably in another thread.

"You expect me to be sympathetic to your criticism of one of the very few quasi-conservative outlets?"

Nope, I am making a valid critique of an essay and whether or not you are sympathetic is up to you.

"And you totally blew any credibility in your arguments when you try to say that Al Franken's opinion is worth anything but wiping my @$$ with."

Have you read the book? The issue is generally more the data presented and less the opinion of the presenter, in my mind. Valid points are raised; obviously, people will vary in their opinion of the presenter. He's a mirror image of Rush, that's about it.

"The MMM's own mission statement along with the speeches from the top supporters and organizers belies the TRUTH that they are trying to completely ban the private ownership of firearms? No, didn't think so..."

You know what happens when you assume..... I suggested the conservative writer attack the legitimate flaws with the organization and not make any up. Why distort when it's easy to attack honestly?
--Ian
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