Uechi-Ryu.com

Discussion Area
It is currently Tue Sep 30, 2014 8:01 pm

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 4:39 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2001 6:01 am
Posts: 798
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Ten Percent of 10-year-old American Boys are on Ritalin or Similar Drugs--What Are Our Schools Doing to Our Boys?

and dont worry, they do it to girls only 4% of the time........they wouldnt dare do to girls what they do to boys....(maybe occasionally, or once in a while, but never on the scale that they do it to boys).......boys are two and half times more likely to be put on these drugs than girls.........and i suppose that is equal and fair.........

Quote:
According to Warning Urged for ADHD Drugs: Panel Cites Risks, Fears of Overuse (Washington Post, 2/10/06), 10% percent of 10-year-old American boys are on Ritalin or similar drugs and a federal expert advisory panel is citing "reports that they may have caused sudden deaths or serious complications." According to the Post:

"Several drugs widely used to treat attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder should carry a prominent 'black box' warning because of reports that they may have caused sudden deaths or serious complications, a federal expert advisory panel recommended yesterday.

"The proposal to require a warning on medications such as Adderall and Ritalin took the Food and Drug Administration, pharmaceutical companies and advocates by surprise. The panel voted 8 to 7 to call for the labeling change after reviewing reports of several dozen patients who suffered cardiac arrest, toxic reactions or sudden death while using the medications.

"Members of the board said the recommendation was driven as much by worries that the drugs are being overused in the United States as by the possible side effects: About 10 percent of 10-year-old American boys are taking such medications, and there have been recent sharp increases in the number of adults taking them.

"'On the surface, it is hard to believe,'" said Curt Furberg, professor of public health sciences at North Carolina's Wake Forest University Medical School, who voted for the black-box warning. 'What is also interesting is this condition is not really recognized in other countries -- you wonder what we are treating. I am sure there are patients who need these drugs, but it is not 10 percent of all 10-year-old boys.'"

From my experience as a teacher I can tell you that there are some kids for whom the drugs are useful--I've seen it firsthand. On the other hand, for most boys it is useless and counterproductive. I've long campaigned against these drugs, and it seems that every time I discuss this problem on a radio show some aggrieved mother or father calls up and tells me that the school wants him or her to put their kindergarten or first grade son on Ritalin. It's an outrage. The problem is not our boys--the problem is that our schools refuse to adapt and accommodate boys' educational needs and learning styles. In my column The 'Boy Parent Dilemma' (Los Angeles Daily News, 9/6/02) I noted:

"Modern schools are not suited to boys' personalities and learning styles. This can be seen from the time boys enter school, when many of them are immediately branded as behavior problems. The line of 10 kids who had to gather every day after school in my son's first grade class for their behavior reports--all boys. The names of kids on the side of the chalkboard who misbehaved and would lose recess--all boys. The kids as young as five or six who must be drugged so they will sit still and 'behave'--almost all boys...

"This afternoon, millions of us will pick our little sons up from school and hope to hear that it was a good day. Yet many of our boys will have spent much of the day being scolded and punished, often for doing nothing more than being boys. And with each of these mistreated little boys--waving their arms and running toward us across the yard, happy to be away from that place where everything feels so unnatural and they somehow always seem to be doing something wrong--comes the boy parent dilemma."


please pass the amphetamines...........please pass the speed.............more drugs please.............

does that raise any hypocrisy issues from those who declared a war on drugs and then threw lots of drugs at our children.........but that is ok as long as they are thrown at us by pharma reps and doctors without summer cottages, then it doesnt warrant a lifetime in prison......

_________________
Seek knowledge from cradle to grave


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 5:54 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:37 pm
Posts: 237
I would think this thread ties in well with the one about "bias in schools toward girls". Far too many little boys are perscribed this for "fidgiting" in class and causeing general mayhem. The problem is "boys will be boys" and parents/teachers need to understand this before forcing the child to take drugs. And I do mean FORCE.

I have several family members who are child educators who have watched, in horror, as school districts ORDER parents to give their kids behavior modifying drugs (or be forced to leave the school/district). By today's standards my younger brother should have been on one of these drugs from K through 9th grade. He was an absolute hellion :twisted: ! He is now a happily adjusted USMA-WP graduate and Captain in the US military.


chewy


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:53 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 12, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 1688
Location: Weymouth, MA US of A
Without mentioning names, can you tell us the towns/mumicipalities where this occured, Chewy? I am keenly interested to know.

Gene


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 7:39 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 4:54 pm
Posts: 1205
There are several camps out there which dispute even the legitimacy of ADD as even a disorder at all.

http://www.hyperfast.homestead.com/fakediagnosis.html

http://www.sntp.net/ritalin/myth_1.htm

My vote?

ADD is bogus.

He's something else which I am not sure anyone has brought up:

Examine the cases of school shootings and violence, and see how many of the children were diagnosed with either depression, or ADD, and see how many of them were on Ritalin and or other recent anti-depressant/Mood Balancing drugs.
From what I have seen casually, there appears to be merit for further investigation.

Ritalin, (Known as Methylphenidate) which, as pointed out here, is in the meth-amphetamine family.
Albeit more dull from a molecular standpoint, but still classified as a CNS Stimulant.
Not lightweight stuff by any means.

And though I am not a lawyer, I have heard that in some school districts, the SCHOOL NURSE has the authority to diagnose ADD and to force the child to remain suspended until such time when the parents can prove that the child is on the drug.

That's just great.
Untrained, Unlicensed, glorified lunch ladies making the decision to place my child on a meth-amphetamine like substance.

In the 70's it was "Hyperactivity", and now we have ADD.
I got news for you America,
THE KIDS ARE NOT MENTAL, THEY ARE NORMAL, FIDGETY, INATTENTIVE CHILDREN! THAT'S WHAT KIDS DO! WHY??!! BECAUSE THEY ARE KIDS, FOR CRYING OUT LOUD!

Schoolteacher: Little Johnny doesn't seem interested in class..he seems bored..he can't pay attention, and he fidgets and forgets things as soon as a tell them...Why, it couldn't possibly be because my teaching style is boring, outdated, ineffectual and dry..why HE MUST BE MENTAL!! QUICK, GET THAT BOY SOME TINA!!
:roll:

What a croq...

By the way, I was diagnosed with "so called" "Hyperactivity" in the 70's along with half my class...Good thing my folks were too wrapped up in their own lives to take interest at the note from the school nurse, else I'd have been one of "ice"-capades stars like my classmates.
:lol:

_________________
There's a bit of Metablade in all of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 9:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 21, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 1348
Location: Somerville, ma.
chewy wrote:
The problem is "boys will be boys" and parents/teachers need to understand this before forcing the child to take drugs.


I generally don't like the idea that "boys will be boys" as I think it excuses behaviors that really shouldn't be tolerated (I.E. destructiveness, mayhem and serious misbehavior) but I definitely agree that Ritalin is basically used as a cure for childhood much of the time. An inability/unwillingness on the part of a 10 year old to sit and be bored for 6 hours a day doesn't surprise or concern me. I think the answer lies in finding better ways to educate kids who don't conform well.

Unfortunately I have no suggestion as to how to do that cheaply enough for people who consider education a lower priority than a new TV.

_________________
- Justin Powell


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 9:42 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 4:54 pm
Posts: 1205
Valkenar wrote:
chewy wrote:
The problem is "boys will be boys" and parents/teachers need to understand this before forcing the child to take drugs.


I generally don't like the idea that "boys will be boys" as I think it excuses behaviors that really shouldn't be tolerated (I.E. destructiveness, mayhem and serious misbehavior)


Meta: I hear you on that one Val.
However, while I do believe that boys in general are more prone to items which nowadays many people label as ADD, (It's a testosterone thing) I think that it's bad parenting that is the real culprit.
It seems that ever since the 60's and that psycho pansy Dr. Spock had parents brainwashed (and still do for the most part) that spanking a child will lead to mass murderers.
Now a days, if I even so much as touch my child, I can go to jail.
And don't think that kids don't know it.
Luckily, my glower and my voice is just as strong as my backhand. :lol:

But seriously, it seems that discipline both physical and mental has eroded in childrearing recently.
Too many distractions, (for parents too)
Parents working too many hours as well, not to mention the vast number of single parent households.
Barring civil and women's rights issues, I wonder if perhaps the "old fashioned" way of parenting isn't better.

Besides, when has there ever been a mass murderer who claimed that they killed because were spanked because they made the neighbor eat a snail..Not..that that ever happened to me mind you... :lol:

Yes, abuse exists, and it's wrong...But haven't we crossed the line from normal, average discipline techniques to doing nothing at all besides talking?
What's next? Being arrested because we sent our children to their rooms as punishment because of "false imprisonment" and "undue mental anguish?"
:roll:

The solution to all these so called "behavioral disorders is simple.

It's called "The belt!"
:lol:

_________________
There's a bit of Metablade in all of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 10:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:37 pm
Posts: 237
Gene DeMambro wrote:
Without mentioning names, can you tell us the towns/mumicipalities where this occured, Chewy? I am keenly interested to know.

Gene


I can tell you of at least one incident in Upstate NY (greater Rochester area) and one in Baltimore.

chewy


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 10:14 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 12, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 1688
Location: Weymouth, MA US of A
Please do, Chemy. If you have links or citations to news reports, or legal decisions I am interested as well. Details are quite helpful. Just because you "heard it" doesn't make it so.

Quote:
And though I am not a lawyer, I have heard that in some school districts, the SCHOOL NURSE has the authority to diagnose ADD and to force the child to remain suspended until such time when the parents can prove that the child is on the drug.


Do have more information on this, Meta? And after 4 years of college and the examination process, your description of nurses being glorified lunch ladies is, well, wrong. And maybe you ought not make such statements until you do become a lawyer.

Gene


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 10:14 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:37 pm
Posts: 237
Valkenar wrote:
chewy wrote:
The problem is "boys will be boys" and parents/teachers need to understand this before forcing the child to take drugs.


I generally don't like the idea that "boys will be boys" as I think it excuses behaviors that really shouldn't be tolerated (I.E. destructiveness, mayhem and serious misbehavior) but I definitely agree that Ritalin is basically used as a cure for childhood much of the time. An inability/unwillingness on the part of a 10 year old to sit and be bored for 6 hours a day doesn't surprise or concern me. I think the answer lies in finding better ways to educate kids who don't conform well.

Unfortunately I have no suggestion as to how to do that cheaply enough for people who consider education a lower priority than a new TV.



Agreed on all counts. Unfortunately, some teachers won't even tolerate minor offenses; especially, when a little boy is held up to the shining examples of well-adjusted girls in the class.

chewy


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 12:22 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 4:54 pm
Posts: 1205
Gene DeMambro wrote:

Do have more information on this, Meta? And after 4 years of college and the examination process, your description of nurses being glorified lunch ladies is, well, wrong. And maybe you ought not make such statements until you do become a lawyer.
Gene


Meta: Let me guess, you know someone personally who is a school nurse?

Meh..I stand by my words, as they are concluded from my own childhood and parent experience.
Yours may have/had/does differ.

When I meet a Public School Nurse who can diagnose and treat diseases like a real doctor does, I'll change my view.
But things being as they are, let's just say that my view of the school health care system isn't "glowing."

Though I may not be a lawyer, I play one in my mind.
:P

_________________
There's a bit of Metablade in all of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 3:24 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 12, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 1688
Location: Weymouth, MA US of A
I am not related to a school nurse. I just call people on their ignorant comments when they are clerly off line. Iwas always treated very kindly by the school nurses when I was in school. Sorry you have different stories to tell, but I stand by mine as well.

I don't know any nurse who is qualified to diagnose, either. Which is why I think maybe you're off track on this one.

Gene


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 2:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:37 pm
Posts: 237
Gene DeMambro wrote:
Please do, Chemy. If you have links or citations to news reports, or legal decisions I am interested as well. Details are quite helpful. Just because you "heard it" doesn't make it so.
Gene



Gene,

There are no news stories or legal decisions to be had on these incidents. Just because the info is or isn't on the "internet", doesn't make untrue. Call it hearsay if you want, but I trust the people who experienced this, first hand. You aren't, by chance, a teacher are you?


chewy


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 2:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 17, 2000 6:01 am
Posts: 2813
Location: Massachusetts
A "Nurse Practitioner" can diagnose and prescribe in some circumstances. We'd have to get input from the mecial professionals on the forums to know for certain. Nurse Practitioners go beyond Registered Nurse status and education to take a lot more medical courses and training. They do not become MDs, but they certainly put in a lot more hours of training and course work than RNs. Licensed Practical Nurses (LPNs) are below RNs and usually school nurses have been LPNs. Most places now will not even give a kid who has a headache something because of the huge liability involved. That's understandable given the fact that there are people who are allergic to aspirin (and derivatives) and others who are allergic to Tylenol (tm) (and derivatives), which makes giving a child medication of any kind a potentially fatal mistake. Best to send them to their own MD that knows the child's history, allergies, and situation.

Anecdotal comments are fine, but please try and refrain from too many blanket statements that cast entire groups in negative light. I have no doubt that there are and have been fantastic school nurses, but I also don't doubt that there are many who are or have been nothing more than "glorified cafeteria ladies". The same goes for teachers... I am sure that there are many good, qualified teachers who have and do inspire students, however I am equally certain that there are and have been plenty of boring moronic "teachers" who push their inabilities and incompetence off as being some sort of ADD or ADHD in the children.

Back to the Nurse issue... Any comments from medical professionals on the forums to clarify is greatly appreciated.

Back to blanket comments... I don't require anyone to be "PC", but I expect folks here to have enough intelligence to realize that not everyone of any given group is {fill in the blank with whatever disparaging comment you wish}. I don't think anyone actually feels that way, but I just thought I'd clarify.

(mumble mumble... well maybe some people... haven't formed the final opinion yet... starting to wonder about those purple antartican-bashing baby mutants from Rigel IV...)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 3:07 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 4:54 pm
Posts: 1205
I just wish my school nurse had looked like this:

Image

She can take my temperature any day..
:lol:

_________________
There's a bit of Metablade in all of us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 5:24 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 12, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 1688
Location: Weymouth, MA US of A
No not a teacher. Sharp eyed readers of these forums know what I do to make ends meet.

Pretty decent on the different levels of nursing qualifications, Panther. The school nuses I've had have all been RN. A nurse anywhere can get in big trouble for giving someone - not just a kid - medicine or drugs that have not been ordered by a competant prescriber. And while Nurse Practitioners have more advanced credentials than RNs, they still must be supervised by an MD.

Gene


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group