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 Post subject: Errata/Istanbul???
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:56 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 28, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 2435
Location: MARSHFIELD, MA. USA
Oopps:

Fall of Constantinople, whose people would hardly defend themselves at the time (the task falling to Venetians mostly) was May 27, 1453.

Battle of Manzikert: Aug 19, 1079. An example of everything that can go wrong in one Battle.

The only Sadder Day to me-Adrianople. The day(s) the Legions died forever (in effect).

What was the other Hugh? I know you pointed out one more errata?

Constantinople was thereafter called Istanbul, which simply means 'the City".

Can anyone explain to me why the British just did not give the City back to Greece in 1918?

It would not be hard to see why it could not be done today, of course..

John

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 2:29 pm 
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Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 2:43 pm
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Location: Oakton, VA
I don't recall exactly why Britain did not give the city back or whether they even could but a great account and prophesy of things to come for America in the Middle East can be found in A Peace to End All Peace: The Fall of the Ottoman Empire and the Creation of the Modern Middle East.

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Fall of Constantinople, whose people would hardly defend themselves at the time (the task falling to Venetians mostly)

I'd strongly disagree with the assertion that it fell to the Venetians, even mostly. The Venetians sent very little, though effective, naval support, and grudgingly at that (show me the money).

I'm not sure what you mean by "whose people would hardly defend (my emphasis)". The entire population, from slaves to the Patriarch and Emperor (who gave his life)defended that city (and the West) in 1453. I would dare say the then Roman Popes would have done the same thing, being shifty Medici and all. :) Thanks.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 7:01 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2000 6:01 am
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Location: Virginia
Regarding the fall of Constantinople, you may wish to remember that the city had previously fallen to the Franks in the Fourth Crusade in 1202-1204 and was most thoroughly sacked by them. I rather doubt that it ever really recovered from that, especially since it had lost most of its territory to the Turks shortly thereafter.

As to post-Adrianople weakness, try to remember that the Roman Armies had been bled for, what, nearly 200 years by civil wars for the inperial throne and by a series of plagues that had swept the Empire. The first was the one brought back by Trajan's troops from his Parthian War in 116 CE. There was another one during the reign of Marcus Aurelius and they contiued periodically, enhanced by the ease of trade and communications within the Empire and by the crowded urban conditions that existed in the Empire.

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 Post subject: Well
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:55 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 28, 1998 6:01 am
Posts: 2435
Location: MARSHFIELD, MA. USA
Hi Dale, Hi Hugh:

I certainly stand corrected again. My bad.

My impression that the Venetians were the Primary defenders of The City at the end was probably based on a particular book I read at a particular time.

As usual, it appears even my 'errata' statements need careful research.

Not a Problem. :)

John

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