Bowies Received

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Bowies Received

Postby JOHN THURSTON » Mon Dec 24, 2007 3:30 pm

Hi:

I received the redone Case Bowie. It is as advertised, has a well shaped/polished edge (ie" the angle of the body of the blade is not terribly different than the edge).

It has a plastic (bakelite) handle.

This is not a problem as that is what was on the original in the 60's.

Image

Rated a 9 because of cost and the bakelite handle.

This knife is almost razor sharp.


One Staghorm Model was offered in the 60's but has not been reoffered that I know of.

Here is an expensive Linder Bower with a Stag Handle

Image

I do not own this one. Probably a nine at $200


I also received the Paki Made Bud -k Bowie. It is not as well polished as the case and the required angle for sharpening is steeper.

Image

This knife is sharp. It is my opinion that, after resweeping and edging, it is a well found knife, especially for riding in the bottom of a canoe for 4 days.

There is no PERFECT fighting/field purposed knife. .




I other words, the angle of the blade body is shallower than the edge angle.

For $15 it is still acceptable.

I have seen thei unknown but attractice Black Harwood on some other items from Pakistan and can find no problems with it.

Other than the matters mentioned, the knife is nice.

Sort of a shock.

Several Bowies were listed with UC prefixies indicatiing that they could be United Cutlety.

The Ka Bar I purchased for Sensei Jack, a 60th anniversary Ka Bar relating to Iwo, was distributed by Bud K although great pains were made to present the original Oneida Ka Bar complete with the blueprints and specs on the outside of the box.

I will assume tht the Iwo Ka Bar is no longer available as I could not find it on a quick search, but it may be close to the 100th anniversary model shown:

Image

The Iwo Jima K-Bar and the USMC Kabar are razor sharp and of Oneida Manufacture.


I am nt going to fuss with it, but, for example, as the handguard is not as thick as on the Case (but still adequate) it might be feasible to work it into a configuration closer,although thinner, than the Museum Bowie.

I Don't wish to fuss with mine but if one purchased the Paki, one would only be out $15.00 and whatever labor might go into a polish, reshape, re bending of hanguard, should one undertake the matter as a hobby.

Here is a Pic of the Case Alamo Bowie:

Image


I may entertain purchasing both the Linder Bowie and The Case Alamo Bowie at some point.


Only limited runs of some models can be expected.



John
Last edited by JOHN THURSTON on Mon Dec 31, 2007 9:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Hugh » Wed Dec 26, 2007 2:20 pm

John, have you looked into the Paul Chen Hanwei Bowies from CAS Iberia (CAS-I)? Please see thones in the attached link. I have the Bell Bowie and I think it to be very nice for the money, but it is like the Bagwell Bowies, more a fighter than a camp knife.
http://www.888knivesrus.com/c=VPJyvGd6a ... ie_knives/

You should also look into the Imperial Weapons Generation2 version of the James Daniel Searles Bowie. Clayde Hollis imports them from the Phillipines and he exercises excellent quality control over what he sells. His replicas are well worth the money that he charges and the ones that he has sold out are already rising in value on the collectors market. I have all three of them so far and am quite pleased with them.
http://www.imperialweapons.com/knives.html
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Of Course

Postby JOHN THURSTON » Thu Dec 27, 2007 8:30 pm

Of Course:

I will check these out.

the poiint was, in part, that even the $15 Buck (one of the few on 'his' list of Bowies) is worth having and saving.

The Maligned Buk K offerrs 644 Bowie styles.

Some are krap, and some a superb.

would I advise anyone against buying the Oneida K Bar because it is on that site, hardly, my price is lower than shown on the net.

Would I advocate the Paki Bowie?

Sure, for someone with $15.00.
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Postby Hugh » Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:19 pm

The problem with knives from India, Pakistan, and even the Philippines is that they vary so in quality. I would personally be most reluctant to buy a knife or sword from there unless it was through an importer whom I knew to exercise decent quality control. And, of course, you will pay for that quality control. There is a quote from John Ruskin that used to appear in the Randall knife catalogue that sums this up rather well, IMO.

"There is scarcely anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse, and sell a little more cheaply. The person who buys on price alone is this man's lawful prey."

If you buy a $15.00 Bowie from Bud K and find that the heat treat is lousy and that it cannot be sharpened with less than a machine grinder or that is is too soft to hold an edge, you have nobody to blame but yourself.
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For Reveiw

Postby JOHN THURSTON » Mon Dec 31, 2007 9:04 pm

Quite Right Hugh:

We have been here before.

If one buys only Bentleys (as does my brother in law) he is unlikely to be of much service in evaluating the lower price cars---which would, in his case-be EVERYTHING.

I posted pictures of no less than 15 Bowies. K-Bars, Case, Linder, Rigid, Bone Ruko etc..

Some are great, some are middlin' and some are poor---I guess that is the point.

I will go back and rate those posted here.

Certainly the one Paki Bowie would not be one I'd buy------unless I only had $15.

Having my druthers I'd choose the Rigid posted on another post and a surgical steel, rubber hanled almost a machete which I will later. becasue of it's durability, weight of blade .
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A Further Point

Postby JOHN THURSTON » Mon Dec 31, 2007 9:53 pm

Having owned most of them and kept only two, a further point about field knifes should be made.

US Field cutlery issue cutlery is a disgrace.

I will have to go into my bayonet den and see what is still there.

In any event, if you have a friend in the service make sure he or she has a decent blade.

Let's just take as a group the 'issue' M-16, M-8 (for M-1) M16 bayonet (we'll leave WWII one out since the all went out on guns) VN era issue Machete in a group.


HHHHMMMMMMM they stink.

If you were poor grunt in 1966 the Paki Bowie would have been 10 steps up for you.

The bayonets mentioned were nearly useless and the issue machete could be guarantted to raise a step of blisters in 15 minutes.


Image

The exceptions are the K Bar and the M-9 knife, ( bottom on left and right) neither of which are particularly good at being camp knives.


So if it came down to it beeing my OWN butt doing the swinging, Rigid, K Bar, M-9 (n that order) and a blade such as the Explorer Machete Clone would be my choice.

Lets not let the matter that $200 plus and unavalability stand in the way. Try ANYTHING before you settle on the Service issue.
.


For comfort, indestructebility and sheer cutting power, make my pair the Explorer and Rigid shown.

If you can't find them, Find Something as Good.

Image


Because he or she may be Pitching camp with blisters on one's hand or trying to take another's life so theirs don't get took, PLEASE be sure your friend in the service has something as least as good as in the Picture: Explorer on top, Rigid Below.


Having said that, at least as to what the VN grunt was issued (excepting the odd K Bar) any such soldier would have VERY much better served with the Paki Bowi.

This is NOT to go by way of saying the Paki is a good knife, but goes by saying that you shouldn't forget that your knife and machete were made by the lowest bidder.

DON"T LET THAT HAPPEN TO A FREIND OF YOURS

At least in WWII the vendors had a conscience.

The Probis designed M-9 is OK if ALL that you can have is 1 bayonet/knife.

Again, in camp, the handle design of the M-9 will shred your hands and it lacks blade weight for a good cut.

Jimminy, even the Chinese bandoliers were better than the junk issued by the US., and tthe further one gets aways from the 'big ticket' items the worse it seems to have gotten..
Last edited by JOHN THURSTON on Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Hugh » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:18 pm

John, I am not so much criticizing any particular choice in knives or swords as trying, within my limited knowledge, to spare readers of this forum the mistakes that I and my friends have made over the years. You will notice that I do not get into commenting on Japanese swords and that is because I have very little interest in them and have not studied them enough to comment intelligently on them. But I have been fascinated with Bowie knives since the 1950s and with western swords at least that long. My knowledge of the makers of decent swords has developed with the help of the folks at SwordForums and at NetSword over the past 19 years and, more recently, with my getting into living history. I have had to learn what is available and what is worth the money and time to acquire. As I have grown to appreciate them, I have found that my levels of required quality have risen for my personal purchases but I do remain aware that others may not wish to spend what I am willing to spend to acquire a speciffic item such as a hand made cinquedea or seax from Tinker Pearce. That sort of thing come dear, but there ARE less expensive alternatives available and I have attempted to recommend them.
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Postby Hugh » Thu Jan 03, 2008 2:25 pm

John, there is a thread over in KnifeForums on the subject of Western Bowies that you may find interesting. Here is the link:
http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/showt ... 1178/tp/1/
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Never Fear

Postby JOHN THURSTON » Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:30 pm

Hugh:


I always listen to you.

Lets just the advice and good blades to the guys who really need it.

Japanese swords.

A bottomless pit without hands on effort.

I received a very nice apparent Russo Japanesse war era Katana from Beijing.

It had a "western" style sabre hanger rather than a traditional Saya. This was, I think, somethng of a product of western influence that is not explicable.

I wrote back: Sifu Li:

The sword is special. It is folded forged and the only suggestion that I can make is please think of NOT refinishing the Western Stlye Scaabard in Black paint.

Everything else, including the tsukimaki is or appears to me to be original."

But, since it was painted, it is only worth something to me although i have seen folk pay up to $500 for unsigned bare blades.

If I could get a forge by zoning i wold be trying to make blade on my own in my back yard.

One comment I read said "it may have been that the early Romans did not know they had been making steel blades, but sicnce they, and the gauls, used charcoal in their forges, the carbon entered the blade.

Allegedly, the swords were fired twice in the best of best Gallic forges, and a layer of clay spread down the spine on the second firing.

The blade was not liquid quenched the second time around but allowed to cool in the air.

This seems implausible.

What do you think?

(PS the Rigid is coubly deadly as the semi pointed brass pommel extends well beyong the base of the fist and can kill without cutting.)

john
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The 'Iron Mistress'

Postby Van Canna » Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:53 pm

Image

My personal 'Iron Mistress' hand made by Nelson Cooper before he died many years ago`_

This knife is worth big $$$$$ _ but I will never sell it.
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Wow

Postby JOHN THURSTON » Sat Jan 05, 2008 9:47 pm

Sensei Van:

Spmewhat typically I posted my "wow" comment on your Bowie on a separate threead:

But "Wow". I love a beautiful blade.

Could you look over my comments of basic knife skills for me.

Hugh:

could you post a review on the Nydam Staubing Spatha when convenient? I think you said it was familiar to you.

Image

Eric:

sorry for the delay in making concrete suggestions.

John
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Postby Van Canna » Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:16 am

John,

Thanks. It is a most beautiful blade. Nelson Cooper was a master knife maker.

NELSON COOPER IRON MISTRESS

John Nelson Cooper the knifemaker to the stars Iron Mistress Bowie. This is a big bad blade, 11" of 3/8" stock with an overall length of 17". This is a mint example of Coopers biggest work.


http://members.fortunecity.com/cooper_knives/

As to your basic knife skills_ they sound excellent to me though I have no specific knife skills other than bayonet fighting I picked up during advanced Infantry training.

I don't see myself ever getting into a knife duel.

If I am lucky to see a knife being pulled on me _ I would explode laterally and fire my snubnose hidden in my pocket and from my pocket.

Image
Last edited by Van Canna on Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Watch these soldiers

Postby Van Canna » Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:33 am

Van
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Postby f.Channell » Sun Jan 06, 2008 2:17 pm

John,

To work on knife skills I recommend Raffi. I'm sure Van would second this.
I'm sure you could get him for a group workout.
Put it together and let me know.

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Postby Van Canna » Sun Jan 06, 2008 2:58 pm

Also Wes Tasker 8O
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