Fighting Posture

[Stryke]

but again I say - you gotta start someplace. So is that someplace with your hands down by your sides?
Is it with both of your hands closer to the centerline? Is it with your body 30 percent bladed, 50%?

In a streetfight you won't get these options. In friendly dojo sparring you do. And if the answer is "try and bunch and find what works" well derrr...I'm doing that. That's why I started this thread.

So tell me what works for you. How do you start? You might not stay there very long but you've got to start someplace. (shessh now I sound like a broken record or what?)

Your missing my point Dana , the starting point is dictated by the opponent and position .

It depends on where they are

as a rough guide or idea of what i mean

Closer they are higher the hands

further they are the more blade I`ll employ

facing square I`ll spread into sanchin

if there angled on the outside i`ll be in a sword and sheild jkd type stance/guard

if there inside my sanchin guard , i`ll collapse into sword and sheild or feed like mantis .

Once again it`s push hands stuff to me , and position , If I`m sparring i`m either attacking or rsponding i dont posture except in a defensive response , so it`s determined by the opponents Position not my preference .


to me this is the very thing Martial arts postures are about , its the strategy and position of them , this is to me what Sanchin is , a positional record and strategy , this is the essence of increasig your odds in fighting

[-Metablade-]

It may very well be that the stance is not as relevant as the mindset.
Here are some key elements which I strive to use when fighting:

Note: These can be incorporated into whichever stance one may feel necessary at any given time.

1. Gan (sight): the ability to see your opponents, not just their physical presence but also their character, feelings, and intentions.
2. Soku (footwork): the movement of the body.
3. Tan (courage): one's spirit and attitude toward one's self and fellow human beings.
4. Riki (power): the ability to put into practice powerful strikes and a powerful presence.

Kyo Ku Gi Waku
The four things you must conquer:

1. Kyo (surprise): do not be startled or taken by surprise.
2. Ku (fear): do not let awe of your opponent or fear of failure overcome you.
3. Gi (doubt): do not hesitate or enter into half-hearted action.
4. Waku (confusion): do not let your mind wander and become disordered.

Seme
Literally, to attack. Seme means to apply pressure to your opponent. Basic kinds are:

1. Ki o korosu: break the opponent's will.
2. Waza o korosu: kill the opponent's technique, for example, by changing the distance.

Datotsu no Kikai
Literally, chance to strike. The five most important chances are:

1. Debana: as your opponent's attack is beginning.
2. Waza ga owaru toki: when the opponent's attack is finished.
3. Itsuka toki: when the opponent has settled. Observe patterns of breathing or movement.
4. Uketometa toki: after a block or parry.
5. Matou-toki: when the opponent is uncertain.

[Dana Sheets]

Thanks Stryke - that was excellent.


And Jim - fact of the matter is that if I'm not perfect the power overwhelms. That's why. As I said before - I make mistakes in fighting - if you don't then more power to you - but I'm still in a learning process.

So if I intercept on the right angle but my balance is off then their added force knocks me offline. If I intercept with good footwork but simply missed well then, I missed.

Rory has a quote that I love to steal "In theory, theory and reality are the same. In reality they are different."

There is a big gap between doing something well and doing it perfectly when you're out-weighted by 50-100 pounds and they've got between 5" and 12" of reach.

And over the years I think this is really one major reason women leave dojo training - it is very very frustrating to spar skilled men.

[T W Armstrong]

It's not about posture it's about entry and positional dominance.

This clip illustrates it better as we don't get confused over the terminology but the skill shines through.

Forget technique and posture.

http://www.funny-games.biz/videos/419-c ... fight.html

I love the head butt at the start.

[Dana Sheets]

Friendly dojo sparring is its own animal. It is not ippon kumite and it is not a street brawl. I guess I should have made that clear at the start of the thread.

So I was talking about friendly dojo sparring - a drill that helps you develop timing, entry, accuracy, self-control. What was posted is a link to a brawl - an out and out cat fight. So I was a little confused by that until I realized that other folks were talking about fighting outside the dojo and I was talking about fighting inside the dojo.

Friendly dojo sparring has a few tactics and strategies that may not be applied on the street -- such as: you don't kick your friends in the face if they slip and fall down. It is a way to try different things out without horrific consequences if they fail.

You can take the time to try out principles and approaches...something you really can't do outside the dojo.

[T W Armstrong]

What was posted is a link to a brawl - an out and out cat fight.

I beg to differ Dana. What I posted was a demonstration of someone with very good skills. Someone who who understands positional dominance and exhibits great tactile sensitivity, constantly controling the position. Fighting in the dojo or street is the same it's about position not postures. Sorry you didn't see the clip for what it was. Hope you find what you seek.

[Dana Sheets]

I am finding what I am seeking, thank you kindly.

The clip is a brawl. Yes positioning is used, as is brutality. We don't know why those women are fighting, who is the agressor, who is the victim, why so many people stood aside and let such a thing happen, why these crass bytanders didn't intervene and why someone had such a very good time recording it on videotape.

Holding that woman up as some kind of pinnacle of fighting skills is just plain odd. She was aggressive - yes, she was relentless, yes, she used what little skill was available to her - absolutely.

But that clip shows how endless a fight can be if you don't know a way to finish or a way to walk away. Oh wait - she did finish - when she kicked the other woman in the face....

[eSc]

I think I understand what Armstrong is trying to get across. If you watch the video to see how they try to gain / regain advantage and ignore the stupidity of it all it will make it easier. One woman tries to move into a better (regain) "position" (purple shirt) the other lady moves in a way that will keep herself at an advantage (white shirt). She continues to do this until, like someone else has stated here, the rain becomes a flood and obviously has such a dominant advantage wins the fight.

[T W Armstrong]

Holding that woman up as some kind of pinnacle of fighting skills is just plain odd

I don’t see it as the pinnacle just an example off good positional skills.

she used what little skill was available to her

Little skill? Watch the clip again, some one has some good skills in BJJ and understands very well what they are doing. Maybe because it’s not stand up it evaded you.

why so many people stood aside and let such a thing happen, why these crass by standers didn't intervene and why someone had such a very good time recording it on videotape.

Dana welcome to the real world. Like it or not we can not expect the crowd to sort it out for us.

In violent confrontation we are on our own and can depend on no one but ourselves for salvation.

The Good Samaritan like it or not is rarely found these days when the rotating turbine starts throwing the fecal matter about.

The cavalry is not coming and we can not expect our assailants to play by our rules. Sorry the clip offends you. It offends me too. It offended me when 4 guys beat me with 2x4’s kicked me with steel toes boots until I was unconscious and bloody. Sometimes that flying rectal matter lands on you.

I was trying to help out when I respond to this post. Your response surprises me. But your PM’s in the past have also surprised me. Guess I don’t understand you well enough to have a handle were your coming from. So I’ll just avoid your posts in the future. That should work for both of us no?

You have indicated a desire to learn something about fighting bigger stronger folk etc. Yet you’re offended by two women fighting. You ridicule the level of skill and are offended by the outcome.

If someone outweighs an individual by 100 lbs and everything else is equal. If the combatants are restricted to a specific rule set. I would expect the larger individual will have considerable say about the outcome. Strength and mass is a big part of the equation. If one sticks to rules they will loose. The only equalizer is the determination to prevail. The mindset to survive at all costs does not include being horrified by kicks to the face. IMO

[T W Armstrong]

gain / regain advantage

eSc excellent ! you get it , it's about entry , control , finish.

Not posture or pose.

[eSc]

eSc excellent ! you get it , it's about entry , control , finish.

Not posture or pose.

I see it all the time .. from when I was a kid and we use to "wrestle" to you see it on Spike's UFC shows. Be it the ladies aren't as "prety" (no pun intended) but you can see how the white shirt lady has a better understanding on how to gain and maintain a possitional advantage

And outside of a piece of "study material" this clip offends me as well.

And I don't think I want to know but that description of the 2x4 and rectal matter beating offends me too! My stomach knots up when I think of stuff like that.

[T W Armstrong]

My stomach knots up when I think of stuff like that.

yeah violence *****, sure not a disney story. I've kind of made up my mind to train for the violence that exsists and not the world I wish did.

[JimHawkins]

I agree, with 'Mr. Armstrong'..

Be it real violence, a 'cat fight' a brawl, a sparring match, whatever; Position and dynamic positional adaptation with continuous attacking energy directed into the opponent is what it's all about IMO.

A guard is part of structure, it too creates a reference point - a positional advantage if one can make it work, still to me it is a small part of the big picture, like a capital letter that starts off a correctly written sentence.

sometimes you just don't have time, and sometimes it just doesn't matter IMO, the 'message is sent' just as well, and perhaps a bit sooner.

Static details often don't matter because one must be in action all the time and ANY static position is a dead position and dead positions IMO can make you dead.

I was working a little pak last night with one of my old students. He kept asking about how you defend with pak, like against combos, etc, he kept thinking in terms of defense. I explained it is not your 'block' or your guard so to speak that is going to protect you, rather it is your attack that is going to protect you. The attack can take many shapes, not limited to striking, but in the end the constant pressure of your attack is really what's going to save your face.. Pun intended.

[Oldfist]

I agree, with 'Mr. Armstrong'..

Hi Jim, what do you mean by 'Mr. Armstrong'.. ?

Is he really the guy, Laird, who has been banned from these forums

[Oldfist]

.... but in the end the constant pressure of your attack is really what's going to save your face.. Pun intended.

Actually, that's the opposite of what happened here. The big girl was taken down and, put in side mount by the small girl, who then proceeded to ground and pound her. The big girl had no real ground skills, but she did manage to kick the small girl away. However, it was "the constant pressure of [her] attack" that ultimately got her knocked out. If she had good ground skills, she would have tried to stay in guard after she momentarily kicked the small girl away and created space, instead of trying to follow and ultimately getting knocked out because of it.