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 Post subject: Goshin waza
PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:04 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2004 1:13 am
Posts: 32
Location: atlanta georgia
Here in Atlanta our dojo is made up of mostly women. After months of hojo undo, kyu kumite, conditioning and katas. I felt that something was missing. I could see in my students eyes that although they got a great workout, and learned some basic self defense from kyu kumite and kata bunkai. They were really not sure of themselves or their Uechi.

I know that confidence is not something taught. At least not by me. Drawing from my Jujutsu/Judo back ground. I along with Scott Rosencrants, created 50 self defense techniques. There are five techniques for each level of kyu. 10 kyu ranks-50 techniques. These wazas cover all major attacks from: punches, kicks, wrist grabs, rear attacks, club and knife defense, gun retention, frontal and rear chokes, takedowns and multiple attackers.

Club and knife, gun retention, and mutiple attackers make up the last 10. Which we placed in the ni-kyu, and ik-kyu levels. Close to shodan. The ladies really enjoy these techniques, and I would really love to share them with anyone interested. I am still ironing out some kinks, but possible may present these techniques at next years camp. I would love thoughts and some feedback on prearranged self defense. Negative and positive I will keep everyone posted.

Sal Jaber

Atlanta Uechi Society

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:47 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
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Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY
Sal

This is wonderful. You make me a very proud grandpa. ;)

For those of you who don't know... Sal is Bruce Hirabayashi's student, and a very highly ranked jiujitsu instructor as well. He, Bruce, George and I did a tour of the German dojos a few years back. Sal puts on quite a show, demonstrating effective martial technique as well as remarkable charisma.

Can you tape some of this stuff and send it to me? I promise I won't share it outside our circle unless and until you decide whether or not to publish. I could help you with all that if you wish.

By the way, Bruce called me this week. He's going to show up at camp on Saturday. I'm bringing my own small contingent up for the full 3 days.

Think about coming north some time. We could converge either at my new dojo in Richmond's west end, or somewhere farther north in or near Dana's digs.

- Bill


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 6:37 am 
I would be very interested , if even just a list and description

I am all for impromptu work , but I beleive all good understanding comes form point of reference , providing such a training reference with 50 techniques/point of reference is IMHO very usefull .


firstly the techniques and list would be the most interesting .

On a secondary more academic note , how you considered what was important , and what/why you included in your list of 50 .(variations are potentially endless)

did you take a consideration of generic attacks as iN M`cCarthys HAPV list ?

congratulations on such a work , very interested in learning more .


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:41 pm 
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Hey Sal,

Good to hear that the training is going well. Did you see a shift in the confidence of your students when you started teaching the techniques?

Many women have difficulty making the mental choice that their own well being is more important that someone else's. Many women have difficulty with the idea that the may need to cause pain and damage in order to protect their own well being. I'd suggest asking you students those two questions and seeing how they respond. I usually do that outside of the dojo over a drink or dinner at a dojo social event the first time so that there is less pressure and they can answer honestly without worrying about what a karate student is supposed to say.

I'd be very interested in your list and trying them out for myself. And I'll second Bill's offer. Name a date and we'll see what we can make happen.

Thanks for posting up this idea. Sometimes students need to feel they have a tool in the toolbox against their worst or unspoken fear before they begin to have confidence in their other abilities.

After all, most techniques are an expression of one clear intent, aren't they?

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 2:43 am 
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Location: atlanta georgia
Hey Bill and Dana,

Thanks for the invite, and I would love to share all I have with you. I plan on widening my Uechi horizons by visiting others around the country and world. Starting with SummerFest.

We have 50 base techniques, and most of them have an A. B and C. version. I am still deciding on which ones will be the base. I believe that at the shodan level. The student should be able to learn the transitions between the versions. Keep in mind that my highest rank student is a yon-kyu, so this is still new to them also.

Time permitting I will put all 50 on dvd and send them to you both. You have my permission to share as you will.

And tell that teacher of mine to TRY and keep intouch.

Sal Jaber

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:15 pm 
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I'll tell Bruce the next we chat that he's neglecting you. :D

I pm'd you my contact info.

So are the new techniques having the desired effect? Are the students gaining confidence?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 12:25 am 
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Location: atlanta georgia
Absolutely....

They are maybe a little to confident. :D We keep it fun, but we dont have any unrealistic delusions of grandeur. There is only so much a 120lb. person can do against a 350lb attacker.

See you at camp.

Dana, will you be there this year ?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 11:35 pm 
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Location: worcester, ma
when i was a teen i studied kempo karate, the entire ciriculum revolved around kata and self defense techniques like you described.
just a few thoughts ,
keep it simple , its fun to do complex combinations but in the real world they dont work. i would format the techniques with a simple action ( example ,,foot sweep take down) followed by a few strikes but i would set a few stikes as the standard then as the student moves to the next rank i would allow them to change the follow up strikes( or pre -strikes) so they can work on mental reaction rather then by memory.

steve


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 9:38 pm 
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hoshin thanks for the input. Sal and I , sorry my name is Scott Rosencrants (Shodan), are trying to keep it simple and yet very effective. All input is welcome, especially for me as I attempt to create a written record/description of each technique that is neither too verbose nor too limited in its explanation. A key component in our development is to guide different attacks to the same finishing technique to create a reaction without the "what technique should I use now" to prevent the "deer in the headlights" response. Please any and all who have input on archiving info let me learn from your experience. Thanks

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 2:24 am 
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Location: worcester, ma
hey scott,
i intergated some judo and some aikido into what i teach. there are 3 basic arm controlls that work really well in aikido so i used numbers for their names ( aikido does the same but in japanese) as an example technique number 1 is an arm bar. every one knows that number 1 designates the arm bar part but the attack could be a punch, kick, club or knife. there would always be some kind of finnish action but these can be addapted to fit the situation. this kind of reminds me of ordering chinese food #34 beef lomain and being able to get 2 side orders with it like crab ragoons or chicken fingers. you should also be able to flow from one technique to another if the first is not working. one problem i see is that if students learn by memory that this response is for this attack , when given something that does not fit into a particular classification the mind will go blank and not know what to do.
could you explain a little more about the "different attacks to the same finnishing techniques " part?

steve


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:25 am 
My personal preference to avoid which technique to which response , is to rather than link them to attacks , I link them to body position , so when one finds themselves in said position(however they get there) they have another option .

Just another approach .


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 6:08 am 
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Location: NYC
Stryke wrote:
My personal preference to avoid which technique to which response , is to rather than link them to attacks , I link them to body position , so when one finds themselves in said position(however they get there) they have another option .

Just another approach .

The right approach IMO..

The position (of all combatants and their tools) must be correct as must the energy and timing.. The conditions must dictate the response, based on a common unifying (simplification) reference--or even create the start of the response (energy/position). Otherwise one is left to *choose* the response, which requires much time and then once chosen, a reposition of the body/tools (to get the right position) may well be needed--more time lost.. All before the response starts and by then it may well be too late (timing degradation) because the position and energy by this time will likely have changed again (new conditions).

"The opponent's technique (based on position and force) is my technique."

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 7:30 pm 
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I apologize for the vagueness of my post. When I referred to different attacks to the same finishing technique the purpose as I see it right now is that regardless of the attack, say for example wrist grabs, there are several paths to the same end, say, arm bar on the ground face down. Now for a different attack a simple punch( or knife thrust ) the progression flows to any of the already known paths of the wrist grab techniques. This way the the familiarity of repetition short circuits the thinking response to an action only response. This sounds oversimplified without discussion of environment, but IMHO both attack and defense are affected/dictated by environment. The idea is build on itself in a simple manner as the addition of attackers and or weapons becomes complicated the response remains simple and direct. I don't see a prescribed defense for a specific attack, simply control the weapon(fist, foot, knife, stick, chain, gun, etc) and flow with the technique taking what is given.

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