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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:59 pm 
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robb buckland wrote:
Van put your skirt on !!!!LOL :lol:


How's this Robb?

Image

:lol:

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 Post subject: Traditions...
PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 11:14 pm 
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Without strong traditional roots there would'nt be the explosive infighting success storys that we tell today ......"Love that skirt Van !!!!!"

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 12:46 am 
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Robb,

The tack you take on the fear emotion seems to be consistent with the excellent article by Darren Laur....the anatomy of fear.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 1:17 am 
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This thread can benefit from this sagacious article by Darren Laur on the subject matter:

http://www.personalprotectionsystems.ca ... or-spirit/

Check it out.

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 Post subject: Emotion in Training
PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 2:26 pm 
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From your suggested article Van....



"To foster Winning Mind and Warrior Spirit, we need to combine emotion and imagination in our training. A popular training ethos echoed by many is, “ train the way you want to fight, and you will fight the way you train.” Without emotion and imagination, such training will be nothing more than playing patty cake with one another. Our goal is to make the trained response the dominant response through repetition combined with emotion and imagination. We NEED to make our training real so that all of our learning modalities are engaged so that in combat what we do is habit or stimulus response based."..........................

So if I were a staunch traditionalist I might say I work these attributes by performing my Sanchin with graduating intensity :!: :?: :!: :?:


Good article by the way !! :wink:

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 7:39 pm 
It's hard to do with people though..even hard sparring i.e full contact with gloves, you will find the "red mist" descending on you...some folks have said to me that " they like to go hard" when what they really mean is they want to hit you...Buuuuuuuuut when you come right back at them then they cool down real quick...there is stuff that beginners find real hard to do.like a good ki ya ( sp)....which helps immensly, once you have the confidence to do it in a room full of folks...it is even harder to do when you don't do a technique.when you can do it then you don't need to do it.you can do it with your eyes :lol:
and also to think of death is important.........you really must..I believe.....think of those poor folks in the planes in 9/11.......ok you get the boxcutters of the bad guys , you kill them..then you have to stop the plane crashing 8O .sometimes the odds are just too much..that is why I am so interested in the old Samurai ways 8) ........folks like master Kuroda
and his viewpoints on kata ..which trancends all the stuff I've heard folks say about it
http://www.bugei.com/kuroda.html

Why did Master Uechi teach a 3 year Sanchin?......maybe he was trying for something like master Kuroda was aiming for........if you can't do that maybe you have strayed from the path :cry:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXsMSoXrNgo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzyPw-uJ ... re=related

is he a " Warrior".are we?.......when was your last fight? :lol:


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 Post subject: The Real Warriors
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:04 pm 
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL-0mdEg ... re=related

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:13 pm 
it's easy to be a soldier..........an insurgents life is far harder

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2weq2G0 ... playnext=1


and they are far harder than any marine

The English army were sent in to protect the ira and the republicans from the " loyalists"............IMHO that was a mistake :evil:


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:54 pm 
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Insurgents...I agree...like the American Minutemen who kicked the British troops into hell, after the tea party.

Marines? Ever seen how they train physically and mentally?

There is no better fighter in the world than a marine on a battle field.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:48 pm 
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robb buckland wrote:
"To foster Winning Mind and Warrior Spirit, we need to combine emotion and imagination in our training. A popular training ethos echoed by many is, “ train the way you want to fight, and you will fight the way you train.” Without emotion and imagination, such training will be nothing more than playing patty cake with one another. Our goal is to make the trained response the dominant response through repetition combined with emotion and imagination.


Vann, Robb, And Ray,
Okay gentlemen, I agree that we need repetition and a level of reality in our training. I think, without causing real harm to one another, that is part of where the imagination and emotion come into the training, as noted in the good article that Vann posted.

That said, I also would like to move into a discussion of the emotion and imagination part of training, as that is more in line with the OP of this thread. I think we can all agree true warriors need to train physically, mentally, and emotionally. If you are training well, we hope that the physical aspect will eventually come into true alignment, along with muscle mechanics and memory....

But we are speaking of the warrior spirit/mind here, not simply being a good fighter. The two are related but not always the same. Knowing this is a broad generalization, men tend to be very physical in thier expressions of emotion and mental concepts.

Women, IMHO, often focus more inward in these endeavors and they do not always find phyiscal expression. Fortunately, as demonstrated by some modern female athletes and competitors, that is not always true. However, simply training for a "real fight"...even when that is not a high likelihood for most people...does not necessarily equate to developing a warrior/combat/fighting mentality and spirit. So, for a more female point of view (since this IS the women's forum)...I'm interested in things that can help develop that mindset.

Its like several of the items noted on the "little things" thread. Slowly, over time, buildling up an alertness, an awareness, and willingness to take action...an aggressiveness that is rooted in calmness. Repetitive, daily, conscious habits can allow that mental alertness and viewpoint to take root.

In other words, gentlemen, your comments and thoughts are very appreciated and very useful..but for some karateka, especially beginners, they are not all that is needed to develop the mindset we are discussing.

Some of the things you take for granted may not be "obvious" for all people who start in training. I wonder, if all of this was so clear to you when you began a long time ago :wink:

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:50 pm 
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As noted in the article:
Quote:
“ As instructors and students of combatives, we need to understand that we all have within us the warrior spirit. Our mission is to develop, foster, and nurture that warrior spirit through realistic physical and psychological training. Defining Warrior Spirit is not always easy, but two authors have encapsulated the essence of this often-misunderstood attribute:

"A warrior is on permanent guard against the roughness of human behaviour. A warrior is magical and ruthless, a maverick with the most refined taste and manners, whose worldly task is to sharpen, yet disguise, his cutting edge so that no one would be able to suspect his ruthlessness”


--The Power of Silence, Carlos Castaneda

“ The Warrior fights because he believes that he is fighting for something good, something positive, something that will improve the quality of the world around him. The warrior never forgets that he is an example and so will always act accordingly. He is a leader, and when there is no one else to lead, the warrior must lead himself forward to a different, higher standard.” --Unleashing the Warrior Within, Richard J Machowicz


Again gentlemen, I honor and value what you have offered, but I'm also not certain that is the whole package. As noted in the above quote, there is an essence of leadership, honor, and serene/calm maskign of the ruthless agressor available to be unleashed. That would also implyu that part of this mentality needs to be controled. So control is also an interesing part of this mentality that we have not discussed.


Some folks have life experiences that ingrain this awareness and aggresiveness in them...many do not. Many men and women, and I will admit more women due to cultural settings, grow up learning to always be polite and/or be trusting and oblivious to thier surroundings. Learning to be centered, focused, and able to violently strike out without hesitation are things that many folks have to learn.

So to step away from specific warrior examples and political examples....let's talk more about how to utilize that imagination and creativity in our training to instill a more warrior or combative mentality so it is available when/if needed.

[As an aside, I don't think Steinbeck's King Arthur is the best adaptation of the story cycle AND to say the sword is more important than the shield is in direct conflict with the original story of Excaliber. Personally, I would put the mind in front of the sword and shield, as you would not know how to properly use either without it. You can have a finely honed blade, but without the mind to properly direct it and react, it's just a pretty shiny thingy. That said, the sword and shield need to be properly honed to work effectively. I understand that part of the comment in the article is to be offensive not defensive (as in fighting, not in stench or general behaviour :lol: ), as you want to end the fight, not simply drag it out or survive the battery. I simply disagree with the author of this particular quote.]

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:16 pm 
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There is a thread on Vann's forum about training to self defense that addresses some of the emotional and psychological ideas we are discussing here. Very worth a skip over there to read if you aren't already:
http://forums.uechi-ryu.com/viewtopic.php?t=20325&highlight=

some particular notes:
* the comments about how real confrontations don't take place in the context of sparring
Quote:
The difference between the dojo and the street is the unknown. Remember, awareness, consent and preparation will not be present. Your attacker will not be squaring off you, he is not there to "spar".


* excepts from Robb Buckland's comment (emphasis is mine):
The following are some notes Ive gotten from my association with Joe Lewis.......

The mind should never tire , only your body or someone with no heart and a difused fighting spiirit will yeild to adversity, overwhelming odds, or the inability to endure pain. Real fighters do not have contempt for caution unlike daredevils...unlike cowards they posess the balls to function in the face of ANY adversity.
You must rely on resolve , and be able to dig down to access that inner animal fight within .......
Train every day...[...]

" Victory goes not always to the strongest , but to those who keep fighting and never quit. "

Great fighters are not afraid of their own powers , or who they are. To have the courage to willfully exercise making the choice to face the difficult personal challenge of persuing greatness , allows one to gain the understanding and the experience of discovering what is the most dominant psycological principle which motivates them to fight or to strive for greatness......."
+ Of particular importance to small fighters, and many women, is that comment about strongest versus determined.

* Robb again:
Quote:
Real fighting is a test of wills : who quits first


So, what I get from this thread and the above quotes is the following needs:
* realization of where our training does and does not take us.
* the need to train and develop our own courage, tenacity, will, and spirit

Good stuff...how do you work on these things in your mental, phyisical and psychological training?

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 5:56 pm 
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When it comes to attitude if your'e in doubt , scared to death or if you have some kind of first time confidence problem , attack ! attack ! attack ! (George S Patton)

With any skill or tactical principle youv'e got to get a strong sense of willingness to engage and an eagerness to get in there and to express an ill will type of intent. You must know how to focus in the present tense You cant be thinking of how he just hit you , or what's going to be your next movement .That puts you either in the past tense or the future tense......STAY IN THE PRESENT TENSE.

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Last edited by robb buckland on Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:01 pm 
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good thoughts, any suggestions on how to develop and encourage that "NOW" mindset?

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:31 pm 
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"A warrior is on permanent guard against the roughness of human behaviour. A warrior is magical and ruthless, a maverick with the most refined taste and manners, whose worldly task is to sharpen, yet disguise, his cutting edge so that no one would be able to suspect his ruthlessness”

Wow that hits it on the head !!!!!



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