Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

A place to share ideas, concerns, questions, and thoughts about women and the martial arts.

Moderator: Available

Post Reply
david
Posts: 2077
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Location: Boston, MA

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by david »

Is it Van Damme, Seagal, Rothrock, Lee, Speakman, Long...? Well, mine happen to be Xena and Gabrielle in "Xena -- The Warrior Princess."

Okay, laugh if you want to. The fact is those martial artist and their movies have nothing over Xena. It's all choreographed fantasy and we aren't going to learn any techniques in dealing with BG's watching those movies. The fights in Xena are so clearly FANTASY, like the Chinese Martial movies of old, there is no confusing or pretending that the moves are real. The actresses playing Xena and Gabrielle aren't even martial artists!

So, why do I like Xena? Well, sandwiched between the episodes that are whimsical, musical, silly, and everything else, there are episodes that provide real philosophical discussions of violence, pacificism, personal power and the lingering effects of violent action, justified and otherwise.

The two protagonists play off each other with Xena representing the warrior's way and Gabrielle representing the way of "peace." (I must note that I missed many episodes and Gabrielle seemed to have "hardened" in her perspective, along with trading her staff for two Okinawan sai's -- boot mounted.) And, perhaps, the gender of the protagonists has a play in that they are able (allowed) to voice their perspectives about war, peace and love, showing their inner conflicts and turmoils in ways that male protagonists are not allowed to do without appearing "wimpy."

I caught an episode today and it was one of the better ones. We have the protagonists protecting Ely - a Ghandi type -- against Aries the God of War. Ely threatened to bring on the Twilight of the (petty) gods by preaching love, peace and fearlessness among humans. Aries took it upon himself to kill Ely while his human troops are being held up in fight with Xena. Gabrielle was left to defend Ely from Aries. Ely beseiged Gabrielle to step aside because, steeped in his conviction, he did not fear dying. Gabrielle stepped aside in deference, torn and conflicted with her love for way of peace and a "Xena" like belief that sometimes one must fight for right. Subsequently, Ely was runned through by the sword of Aries.

Xena came back to find Gabrielle over the body of Ely. "You defended him, didn't you?", she asked. Gabrielle stormed off, screaming "Don't blame me! Don't blame me!" In anger, Xena screamed out "It's people like us (warriors) that make it possible for people like him (Peaceful Ely)!"

Grabrielle, alone, was confronted by Aries who tried to assuage her guilt by saying she really understood that "might makes right, even when it's wrong." He tried to tempt her with an alliance by giving her a glimpse of the power of the gods -- the power of might and of life and death. Gabrielle's inate sense of right prevailed.

In the meantime, Xena found a magical dagger with power to kill a god and went to find Aries. She found Aries confronting the followers of Ely. Aries was urging the followers to give up Ely's Way, and to go back to as they were, or face death. Xena attacked. At the verge of slicing Aries' throat, the spirit of Ely appeared. Xena was asked whether this was the way to honor his memory... Xena withdrew, despite taunts of Aries to "do it!" "No!" reply Xena. "The Way and teachings will continue. The Twilight of the gods will come..."

Oh well, that's my cold saturday afternoon in with the kids. Image

david
Cecil
Posts: 309
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 1998 6:01 am
Location: Washington DC area, USA
Contact:

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by Cecil »

Man, sorry I missed it. I've had a lot to deal with so I couldn't be home (wife just had a baby, both are at the hospital.)

I admit I like looking at Xena and Gabrielle ;-). But, I also like the show better than Hercules because 1) the acting is a lot better 2) the stories deal with emotional issues 3) it has more martial arts in it.

You hit on something that I wish I could see disccused either here or another forum, and that is the fact that Xena and Gabrielle get to deal with emotions on screen because they are female characters. Mind you, I don't want to see too many of my male heroes crying like it is the lifetime channel, BUT, it would be cool to show how the guy warriors feel every once in a while. The Hercules show does that every once in a while. Or should I say did that. Did they cancel it?

I do know that Lucy Lawless (Xena) was starting to take a little Aikido, but I think that was merely to help her swing the sword better on screen. I don't think that either one of the lead characters are actually Budo students.

However, the extras on that show, now they know some stuff. It takes some skill to be able to fall like that!

Cecil

------------------
Email: <A HREF="mailto:creativebrother@yahoo.com">creativebrother@yahoo.com</A>
Web Page: http://creativebrother.freehosting.net
student
Posts: 1062
Joined: Mon Nov 08, 1999 6:01 am

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by student »

Both Lucy Lawless and Kevin Sorbo study with Douglas Wong.

I haven't watched either show in quite some time. Maybe I should. I believe both Karen Shepard and Cynthia Rothrock have had parts on one or the other.

student
david
Posts: 2077
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Location: Boston, MA

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by david »

Cecil,

Congratulations! Hope everything goes well with your child and wife.

I didn't mention that Xena is pregnant on the show (perhaps in real life?) and is the now the Warrior Princess and Mother to Be.

In this same episode, there is the subplot involving Calistro, Xena's long time nemesis. In another episode, Xena rescued Calistro's spirit from Hell where she was an involving demon. Xena did so out of guilt for having killed Calistro's family and engendering the hate and bitterness that became Calistro. In freeing Calistro, Xena took her place. Xena's dark side externalized and made her into a demon. Grabrielle with an army of angels, of course, rescued Xena at the end of that episode and brought her good side back.

So, in yesterday's episode. Xena's good side prevailed when she stepped back from Aries. Calistro's spirit was present with Ely's. Calistro spoke of not being overcomed by hate, that she too had to come reconcile her past and there has to be forgiveness and so forth. Xena is still conflicted about Calistro. While she recognized that Calistro became an angel and a spirit of light, she cannot let go of the dark memory of the Calistro as the enemy. Calistro replied that it is her time to move on. She must be reborned (Big Karma) and it has been ordained that she be reborn as Xena's child. This is the cosmic reconciliation -- as mother loves her child and child her mother -- there must be forgiveness of wrongs past, present and future for love to prevail...

I admit I am sucker for these discussions of karma, dark and light, hate and love, and so forth. The Hercules show definitely rarely gets into these. While there is a clearly a bond between Youlis and Hercules, there are very few episodes where the two male protagonists let down their emotional guard to the extent that Xena and Gabrielle do. In that sense, Hercules and Youlis are the stereotypical heroes and do not engage our thinking -- at least my thinking -- about various issues.

Any responses from the female forumites. Or is Xena just a male "fantasy?"

david
User avatar
Mary S
Posts: 1472
Joined: Mon Aug 16, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Halifax, NS Canada
Contact:

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by Mary S »

Geez, David...I don't know - I kinda find those teenage mutant turtles sexy!!! Image

Actually one guy that I really like is Jackie Chan...don't know if I would say too much about his combat skills and the plots of his films, but his choreography and timing are impeccable. I also like the way he uses the surroundings and materials available - very inventive. Best part are the out-takes at the end of his films...OUCH!!!!

------------------
Lori
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by Lori »

Hi David-san,

Agreed on the Xena review! I don't get the chance to catch the show that often - but I do enjoy it on a rare, non-busy Saturday afternoon. My sensei is a Xena fan as well - in fact - he even bought a 2000 Xena calendar! Image

True enough about the lack of reality - but entertainment doesn't always have to be reality based - now does it? Fantasy has it's place and the war between good and evil has multiple manifestations...

Great synopsis! Sorry I missed that episode! I am glad that there is a warrior-female actually going through pregancy on a show like that - doesn't make me feel as foolish for going to the dojo all while I was carrying my son!

(Then teaching with him in a papoose pack after he was born! - Wonder how Xena is going to blend motherhood and warrior life?)

As for actors and martial arts fans - I've got to put Toshiro Mifune at the top of my personal list of favorites...

Last year J.D. started a good thread on Van-sensei's forum that listed a lot of the greats - each having a place for a different reason. Maybe he'd deem this forum worthy of a re-post of some of them!

Peace,
Lori
david
Posts: 2077
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Location: Boston, MA

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by david »

Mary,

Must that masked bandit/Zorro thing, eh...? Image

Jacky Chan and Sammo aren't martial artists per se. Trained Peking Opera stars. Peking Opera training doesn't involve singing, rather acrobatic moves to emulate martial arts. Alot of the traditional Peking Opera shows revolve around plots related to emperors, dynasties, generals and soldiers. There is a lot of movement vs. singing.

An ongoing "inside joke" with Sammo in his TV show is him being asked, "Where did you learn how to fight?" His reply is always, "Peking Opera!" BTW, in the opening scenes of "Enter the Dragon", Lee is sparring with a heavy set guy in the Buddhist temple, both clad in black loin cloths. Well, that heavy set guy is a younger and, yes, lighter Sammo. Amazingly, he is still able to do those back flips. :0

david



[This message has been edited by david (edited January 17, 2000).]
david
Posts: 2077
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 1998 6:01 am
Location: Boston, MA

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by david »

Lori,

>>(Then teaching with him in a papoose pack after he was born! - Wonder how Xena is going to blend motherhood and warrior life?)

As for actors and martial arts fans - I've got to put Toshiro Mifune at the top of my personal list of favorites...<<

Think of the Japanese movie, Lone Wolf and Cub...

Toshiro Mifune could have been a martial artist had he turned his attention in that direction, according to his "trainer", the late Yoshio Sugino, a master of Katori Shinto-Ryu and a prewar student of Ueshiba O'Sensei, in an extensive interview in Aikido Journal. Mifune had the ability to pick up sword skills very easily, manifested a certain mindset while training, and can attain "zanshin" (ongoing battle awareness) in his kata. Mifune was also very solicitous and deferential to Sugino sensei, despite being a "big star." In other words, Mifune behaved as he were the dedicated martial arts student that Sugino thought him to be.

david
User avatar
Jackie Olsen
Posts: 619
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 1998 6:01 am
Contact:

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by Jackie Olsen »

LONE WOLF CUB!!! I have some of the early comic books until our bookstore stop carrying them.

I love Xena ... love the yell, the prowess, spear-throwing ... the whole myth.

And I'm also a HUGE fan of Mortal Kombat (#1 only). Somehow, when I hear the music ... sparring becomes less of a threat to me. It's also my favorite shadowbox work out music to use.

It's these brief excursion into the fantasy world that keeps my imagination stimulated.

EIIIIYEEEEEEEIEIEYEIEIEYIEIIIIIIII (blood curdling yell)

Jackie
Shelly King

Screen Martial Arts Heroes?

Post by Shelly King »

Hi guys, nothing like a three day weekend to improve the mood.

Cecil
Congrats on the new baby...I trust both mom and baby are doing fine and will be home soon.

Ok....I'm a closet Xena watcher, left over from the late night study sessions with the guys...something about heat transfer and women fighting in leather that seemed to go well in their opinion. Anyway, I like Lucy Lawless alot (yes, I believe she's really pregnant), it's nice to see a female lead role not be a size 6 little wussy thing that can't fight. I think Gabriella (what's her real name) studies yoga. Actually, I was very happy about the last episode of the x-files I caught, Scully usually ends up getting the crap beat out of her when she gets into fights but in that episode she kicks some butt, doesn't give up and ends up winning. Kind of a refreshing change.

Mary
Love Jackie Chan movies...yeah, the acting and plots aren't that great, but love the fight scenes...and yes the movie outtakes are incredible. I'm amazed the guy is still alive.

------------------
Shelly

[This message has been edited by Shelly King (edited January 18, 2000).]
Post Reply

Return to “Women and the Martial Arts”