A little Philosophy..

Contributors offers insight into the non-physical side of the Martial Arts, often ignored when discussing self-defense.

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A little Philosophy..

Postby -Metablade- » Tue Jan 24, 2006 4:23 pm

And where would we be without it?
But who has time to read the classics?

Now you can read most of them, highly condensed,
...and free of charge.

Enjoy.

http://www.btinternet.com/~glynhughes/squashed/
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Postby wes tasker » Wed Jan 25, 2006 1:28 am

Please tell me you're kidding about this...... As an avid reader of philosophy, I found that site ridiculous bordering on the absurd (and not Camus' idea of absurd...).

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Postby RA Miller » Wed Jan 25, 2006 6:00 am

Wes-
We have more in common than I thought. Can't pretend to enjoy it but I decided to educate myself in western philosophy. So far Plato (Republic and Symposium); Aristotle (Politics, Metaphysics and Nichomachean Ethics); Lucretius; Marcus Aurelius; Augustine and a little Maimonides. Only 15 centuries to go!

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Postby wes tasker » Wed Jan 25, 2006 11:43 am

Rory-

I think that's great, for what it's worth. I'm sorry you're not finding it enjoyable - wait till you get to the 20th century folks.......

Are you planning on reading more of Plato/Socrates? I would also suggest Epicurus (of course, you've read his ideas already in Lucretius) and Epictetus (I have a feeling you'd really find a lot in his writings). Also, if you like some of the "ideas" in Greek thought, the Arab philosophers really kept those ideas alive while working with them and then later influenced people like St. Thomas Aquinas, St. Anselm, and even Dante. The other thing I like about them is that they have continuously worked with those Greek ideas untouched by European philosophy. Some of the more influential ones were:

Ibn Arabi
Ibn Sina
Suhrawardi
al-Ghazali
Mulla Sadra

Of course, I believe Greek thought reached its pinnacle in Plotinus and I would highly recommend reading "The Enneads". It's a fun journey, I think, maybe....... :D

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Postby Dana Sheets » Wed Jan 25, 2006 2:42 pm

however this link off that site is wonderful:

http://directory.google.com/Top/Society ... ine_Texts/

a great meta-search that's already been done.
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Postby -Metablade- » Wed Jan 25, 2006 3:14 pm

wes tasker wrote:Please tell me you're kidding about this...... As an avid reader of philosophy, I found that site ridiculous bordering on the absurd (and not Camus' idea of absurd...).

-wes tasker


Meta:
And specifically, what problem do you have with it?
I thought it's an excellent introduction for folks who may have found the Western classics to be daunting or dry, and perhaps they would not have examined them otherwise.
There's quite a collection there.
If you have something which you might find better, then I offer you to post it, rather than to simply post that it's a joke, which of course contributes nothing.
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Postby wes tasker » Wed Jan 25, 2006 3:40 pm

Meta-

You are correct in the sense that I should have followed up with "why" I thought what I wrote. I believe, that projects like that can be a double edged sword. I agree that it "may" introduce "some" concepts to people who might otherwise not have read those books. My problem lies in the fact that one cannot reduce great books to easily digestable soundbites, or brief outlines - and possible come away with all they have to offer. It's almost like they offer an easy out by making it OK not to have to read, ponder, re-read, argue, assess, etc. the premise of these books. If it prompts someone to then truly start reading these books, than great - but I think that is a rarity. Similar to Cliff Notes always saying that they should be used along with the book - yet how many students buy them to truly use them that way???

If someone were truly interested in studying philosophy - I would suggest a couple of books that introduce the history of it to not only get familiar with the people and concepts, but to then start a list of the actual books to start reading. At least that's what I did.

So perhaps it's fair to say that I find the premise you can gain fluency in these topics with a condensed version ridiculous, as well as the person who thinks they can get the depth and breadth of the subject with these selfsame condensed versions.

There's almost a parallel with the martial arts here as well. If you find a certain art daunting and boring, don't do it. So if you've always wanted to learn the sword, and you find Kendo to be too intense or boring - don't go and join your local "Live Action Role Playing" group and think that you're doing the same thing...

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Postby -Metablade- » Wed Jan 25, 2006 4:01 pm

More and more these days, when I am in mixed company, If I mention in conversation analogies or sayings perteant to the topic of conversation with respect to many of the classic philosiphers, I see more and more quizzical looks such as "Huh?" "Who?" or "Whoa! that's like, deep and stuff!

I find that two things are true:
1. In American society, by and large, Meaningful books,and especially Classical books as well as Philosophy in general are;
for the average person, simply not much part of the mainstream.

2. We have as a soicety, reduced most of the deepern arts and subjects to sound bites or cliff notes.
It is how this generation typcially absorbs information these days. I could point to the titanic success of the "Dummies" books as validation of this point.
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Postby -Metablade- » Wed Jan 25, 2006 4:02 pm

More and more these days, when I am in mixed company, If I mention in conversation analogies or sayings which pertain to the topic of conversation with respect to many of the classic philosophers, I see more and more quizzical looks such as "Huh?" "Who?" or "Whoa! that's like, deep and stuff!

I find that two things are true:
1. In American society, by and large, Meaningful books,and especially Classical books as well as Philosophy in general are;
for the average person, simply not much part of the mainstream.

2. We have as a society, reduced most of the deeper arts and subjects to sound bites or cliff notes.
It is how this generation typically absorbs information these days. I could point to the titanic success of the "Dummies" books as validation of this point.


My attempt was not to present a definitive collection, containing and all, be all, but rather exposure in that if interest was piqued, then of course further investigation would perhaps follow.

With respect to MA, how did you first learn of it?
From a spot on T.V.? Or a book? or a demonstration?
You weren't asked to examine the whole art before you investigated further, yes?

This is my point.
:)

Also, I think one of the largest social issues Americans face is one of less time perceived.(Or at least management thereof)
But everyone has at least 30 minutes to explore the fascinating world of Philosophy, no?
That being said, I would argue it is
better to "Get a generalization" than nothing at all.
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Postby wes tasker » Wed Jan 25, 2006 4:35 pm

That being said, I would argue it is
better to "Get a generalization" than nothing at all.


I would still disagree here, but I tend to be an "all or nothing" type of person :D

You weren't asked to examine the whole art before you investigated further, yes?


Actually, before I started studying with him, I asked my sensei if it was OK to watch a class before I started training. He said something to the effect of "No, either you want to train or you don't..." But that's a whole other story.

It's good you elucidated your intentions of your primary post - they did not come across on your original missive. Which left a lot to be (for better of for worse...) infered. I do agree with your two points - an unfortunate state of affairs...

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Postby -Metablade- » Wed Jan 25, 2006 5:03 pm

wes tasker wrote:
I would still disagree here, but I tend to be an "all or nothing" type of person :D



Meta: This is a "Bushi" mindset, and there is much to be said regarding such a position.

:)
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A taste

Postby nos482 » Sun Jan 10, 2010 2:29 pm

Metablade I think this gives people a little taste. Thank You.
"nobody to many someone to few nos482"
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