Religion: Blight upon humanity?

-Metablade- · Post by **-Metablade-** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 2:40 pm

blight n. - Something that impairs growth, withers hopes and ambitions, or impedes progress and prosperity. The question is simple - to paraphrase Bertrand Russell, is religion the dragon that needs slaying in order to facilitate the societal progress that will benefit all of humanity?

http://www.neuralgourmet.com/religionblight

AAAhmed46 · Post by **AAAhmed46** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 9:34 pm

Well you know, when the portugese eradicated entire races of people using religion as an excuse, it was the portugese FRAIRS and CHRISTIAN monks that actually were the only ones speaking out against thier actions. Most 'secular' intellectules were not like our modern day intellectules; most even promoted such barbaric behavior. But it was the monks and preachers that were against this mass murder.(though they were practicing christians)

Mary S · Post by **Mary S** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:02 pm

Wishing I got the National Geographic Channel - would have loved to have seen the show on the Bookof Judas. Anyone see it? If so, can we have book report (so to speak)?

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:10 pm

Like anything, there are pluses and minuses. Religion offers hope, comfort, community, and values to a lot of people who might not have these otherwise. But it also has been used to control people, and has frequently being used as justification for unethical or immoral behavior from the individual level to the grand scale.

Religious beliefs tend to be very personal to, and strong for, people who have them, largely because the spiritual concept of existence after death tends to be at the core of religious beliefs...and this is a concept most would not want to give up. As such, eliminating religion would be, in my opinion, impossible.

IJ · Post by IJ » Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:38 pm

Religion is just a gun, or a knife. It's the person using it that makes it good or bad. What we do need are religious people who can accept other religious (or secular) people and who recognize what religion and science is or is not good for. An interesting article written by a priest several days ago in the NYT on the study showing that prescribing prayer has no benefit took the scientists to task for studying something that he felt wasn't an appropriate use of religion. He pointed out that the lord's prayer contains no requests for interventions; bishop Spong, in "why christianity must change or die," noted that if we believe prayer causes God to interfere with illness, that implies the poor homeless guy who has no friends praying for him is less favored to God, which conflicts directly with what we believe about God. Meanwhile we don't need religious people to tell us how many planets we have (in Galileo's time, 5: 2 positive, 2 negative, one indifferent, like the orifices of the head) or otherwise interfere with science fact (science purpose, ok).

eastcoast_bsc · Post by **eastcoast_bsc** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:33 pm

On the other hand, look at how many deaths can be attributed to communist Goverments. They are the great secular humanist movements, who denied God and persecuted those that believed.

the Soviet Union appears the greatest megamurderer of all, apparently killing near 61,000,000 people. Stalin himself is responsible for almost 43,000,000 of these. Most of the deaths, perhaps around 39,000,000 are due to lethal forced labor in gulag and transit thereto. Communist China up to 1987, but mainly from 1949 through the cultural revolution, which alone may have seen over 1,000,000 murdered, is the second worst megamurderer. Then there are the lesser megamurderers, such as North Korea and Tito's Yugoslavia.

Obviously the population that is available to kill will make a big difference in the total democide, and thus the annual percentage rate of democide is revealing. By far, the most deadly of all communist countries and, indeed, in this century by far, has been Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge. Pol Pot and his crew likely killed some 2,000,000 Cambodians from April 1975 through December 1978 out of a population of around 7,000,000. This is an annual rate of over 8 percent of the population murdered, or odds of an average Cambodian surviving Pol Pot's rule of slightly over just over 2 to 1.

In sum the communist probably have murdered something like 110,000,000, or near two-thirds of all those killed by all governments, quasi-governments, and guerrillas from 1900 to 1987. Of course, the world total itself it shocking. It is several times the 38,000,000 battle-dead that have been killed in all this century's international and domestic wars. Yet the probable number of murders by the Soviet Union alone--one communist country-- well surpasses this cost of war. And those murders of communist China almost equal it.

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:04 am

Ian beat me to it, but after thinking about my post further I wanted to add that religion in and of itself is not usually the issue, it is the faithful and how they interprete their given religion that can make it negative.

One of my favorite bumper stickers:

God, protect me from your followers!

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:02 am

Mary S wrote: Wishing I got the National Geographic Channel - would have loved to have seen the show on the Bookof Judas. Anyone see it? If so, can we have book report (so to speak)?

I didn't see it, but here is the website for it with a variety of information to click through:
http://www9.nationalgeographic.com/lostgospel/

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:08 am

http://www9.nationalgeographic.com/lost ... eline.html

During the first centuries A.D., in a constantly shifting political environment church leaders shaped the New Testament around four chosen Gospels. But divergent beliefs jostled for prominence in Christian thought. In recent decades long-lost chronicles have been found, originally hidden away during those turbulent times. Such manuscripts describe a world of ideas that has been lost to us for nearly 1,700 years.

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:18 am

This page includes images of some of the pages of the Gospel of Judas, Coptic and English translations of those pages, and downloadable PDFs of the entire text in Coptic and English.
http://www9.nationalgeographic.com/lost ... ument.html

Dana Sheets · Post by **Dana Sheets** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:03 pm

Religion and spirituality have been great organizing forces on all people over time. It is how groups estblished their identities, developed their societies, and pushed the limits of thought and understanding.

We owe religion quite a bit. And it has also been and endless souce of humor. Either due to its zealous adherents, its stunningly odd policies, or in the case of Christianity...its tracts!

Here's a favorite website:
http://www.chick.com/catalog/tractlist.asp

Are Roman Catholics Christians?
Religion can't save, only Jesus can!
See this tract in other languages

Assignment, The
Will Charles respond to the gospel in time?
See this tract in other languages

Back From The Dead?
They thought he was dead, but he woke up screaming, "I've got to get saved! I saw hell! I never want to see it again!" Dramatic!
See this tract in other languages

Love The Jewish People
God has promised to judge those who turn against Israel and bless those who trust her Messiah.

Bad Bob!
Bob was mean and didn't need God, until he nearly died in jail.
See this tract in other languages

Beast, The
This Bible prophecy tract hits hard. Accept Christ or face a time of trouble like the world has never seen.
See this tract in other languages

Best Friend
Let me tell you about my very best friend! He made everything, and is even getting a big mansion ready for me! His name is Jesus. Written especially for children.
See this tract in other languages

Bewitched?
Time was running out for Ashley. Drugs would soon kill her. But a praying grandmother made the difference.

Happy reading...

-Dana

-Metablade- · Post by **-Metablade-** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:43 pm

How Dayah you slanduh tha' Lawd's Mehsehges!
Why, Mr. Chick is nuthin but gawd's dairect messenjah!

Ya'll have Ofehnded Mah chachly sensuhbilitehs!
YOU, Mah dear gurl, is goin' straight tuh Heyall, and roast with all tha rest o' 'them thar sinnahs!

HaleyLOOya!

PraRAYSE JEESUHS!

LOL!

IJ · Post by IJ » Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:34 pm

"On the other hand, look at how many deaths can be attributed to communist Goverments. They are the great secular humanist movements, who denied God and persecuted those that believed."

Well, yeah, my comment about guns and knives applies to the secular world of ideas too. Those thugs weren't very dedicated secular humanists, by today's standards; humanism doesn't get you to mass murder unless you're psycho and power mad. Just like the Nazis and the architects of the Inquisition weren't exactly top christians. They thought they were I suppose.

Instead of judging a movment by its secular or religious bent, we should look at whether or not adherents are "reality testing" and the goals. Habitat for Humanity believes in building houses--and I donate to em. Pat Robertson spouts off about executions and storms and 911 punishing us for abortions, I don't donate. PETA is secular (so I assume) and they're nuts. Most conservation organizations are reliable. And so on.

Dana Sheets · Post by **Dana Sheets** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 8:57 pm

Hey Meta,

I've been going to hell for years. I acutally plan on renting one of those 15 passenger vans and inviting anyone who would like to join me for the long, warm drive down where it never freezes over.

You want I should save you a spot?

eastcoast_bsc · Post by **eastcoast_bsc** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:35 pm

IJ wrote:"On the other hand, look at how many deaths can be attributed to communist Goverments. They are the great secular humanist movements, who denied God and persecuted those that believed."

Well, yeah, my comment about guns and knives applies to the secular world of ideas too. Those thugs weren't very dedicated secular humanists, by today's standards; humanism doesn't get you to mass murder unless you're psycho and power mad. Just like the Nazis and the architects of the Inquisition weren't exactly top christians. They thought they were I suppose.

Instead of judging a movment by its secular or religious bent, we should look at whether or not adherents are "reality testing" and the goals. Habitat for Humanity believes in building houses--and I donate to em. Pat Robertson spouts off about executions and storms and 911 punishing us for abortions, I don't donate. PETA is secular (so I assume) and they're nuts. Most conservation organizations are reliable. And so on.

Actually I was responding to Metablade's sensational headline "Is religion a blight" The numbers show that Atheist Goverments have been the blight against humanity. This was a common denominator, In all the above mentioned Countries who committed Mass Murder and genocide. They all came down on the faithful with an Irin fist and they all were responsible as the numbers show, of crimes against humanity.