Breath wars mark VII

fivedragons · Post by **fivedragons** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 5:17 am

Here's a quote from another so called expert. For all I know, he might be more of an expert than all the other experts.

"Your physical actions should not be invariably linked to any single phase of your breathing (inhalation, exhalation or pausing). You should not form a training habit of always connecting inhalation or exhalation to any particular activity.

For example, imagine you are in a fight and need to punch. It could happen at a moment of your natural inhalation. But if your prior training has created a strong habit of punching only on exhalation, you may be delayed or confused in your response, or you'll simply fail to execute a strong punch. Habitual dependencies like that can lead to interruption of breathing; stoppage of breath; hesitation in movement; loss of energy; loss of balance; and other harmful results."

Just more fuel for the fire.

Stryke · Post by **Stryke** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 5:27 am

you should never empty your lungs , we dont do it even when breathing naturally

so how could it ever be impossible to exhale on immediate movment , and how could that ever be confusing ?

try this breathe out all the air in your lungs , then do an explosive exhale ... youll find even then you have some to give .

but hey to each there own

I`m sure there are many ways to approach this , just dont see this as a problem to the exhalation/strike method .

Van Canna · Post by **Van Canna** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 5:31 am

And then there is the simple answer:

The body will breathe you as it needs to in the moments of need_

Stryke · Post by **Stryke** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 5:54 am

Agreed Van

fivedragons · Post by **fivedragons** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 6:01 am

Whatever you do, keep breathing.

fivedragons · Post by **fivedragons** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 6:10 am

If I ever have to fight for my life, my movements aren't going to be dictated by my breath.

fivedragons · Post by **fivedragons** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 6:31 am

Just another heretic.

Stryke · Post by **Stryke** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 6:46 am

Van Canna · Post by **Van Canna** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:37 pm

Air has ways of 'coming out'

when you least expect it to.

chef · Post by **chef** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:46 pm

It isn't the breathing in that is the problem, you are going to breath in....it is the breathing out. So many hold their breath under stress or hyperventilate.....get light headed, out of breath.....Danger, Will Robins!!!!!

Vicki

Van Canna · Post by **Van Canna** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:58 pm

True, Vicky.

The adrenaline surge, which many Uechi people mocked in the beginning [it doesn't apply to them you know

] is responsible for this 'breath lock' _

The reason why people in 'the know' such as Dave Young [picking him because I know he won't be flamed_ as opposed to flaming other professionals who have breathing opinions] _ teaches the 'programming' of exhaling in engagements, among the many other reasons.

Many are called, few are chosen.

Bill Glasheen · Post by **Bill Glasheen** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 3:49 pm

I don't know Van... I think some people just breathe wrong.

I see all kinds of crazy stuff going on in the comfortable confines of a gymnasium. You see bench pressers doing Valsalva during an extension, with face beet red and veins popping. Oye!

I've got students who just do dumb things when breathing during kata. Forget any one method; they just don't have a clue.

When you throw in some adrenaline, I believe good things get amplified and dumb things just shut the system down. We get reduced to a lower common denominator of activity. If your head's been in a stupid place, you're not going to be doing brilliant things when the grim reaper visits.

It's like a certain someone ( ahem... ) who fought me about doing ukemi. Didn't need it. I knew he did, but he resisted. Young kid. Knows everything at a certain age, you know... Then he went skiing. Decided to do jumps with his skis on the obstacle course.

I saw the X-rays. Dumb, dumb, dumb. Now just how did the ends of that radius and ulna get broken off like that? He didn't know what happened; the X-ray however doesn't lie. No ukemi means body will sacrifice arm to save brain in an emergency. It works. Sort of...

Now how hard would it have been to turn that reach into a slap? Those two motions are soooo similar...

Anyhow, I think we mostly agree with each other, Van. We just argue about the particulars. That's what perfectionists do.

- Bill

Bill Glasheen · Post by **Bill Glasheen** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:00 pm

Your physical actions should not be invariably linked to any single phase of your breathing (inhalation, exhalation or pausing). You should not form a training habit of always connecting inhalation or exhalation to any particular activity.

For example, imagine you are in a fight and need to punch. It could happen at a moment of your natural inhalation. But if your prior training has created a strong habit of punching only on exhalation, you may be delayed or confused in your response, or you'll simply fail to execute a strong punch. Habitual dependencies like that can lead to interruption of breathing; stoppage of breath; hesitation in movement; loss of energy; loss of balance; and other harmful results.

I don't totally disagree with this person. This is where you want to be at a more advanced level in your breathing. It is a place I aspire to.

This however is a place you get to when you know maybe a half dozen or more different ways to breathe under different situations. And each method shouldn't be binary. Push hard? Breathe hard. Push harder? Breathe harder.

(Particulars intentionally left out...)

I feel pretty good for instance if I can get my black belts thinking about maybe 4 different kinds of breathing in a kata like Seisan.

What's the goal? Exactly as this gentleman states. You're able to do what you need to do in a brand new situation. The body eventually frees itself from the myriad methods, and does what it knows to be optimal.

There are however rules to the game. For instance... Imagine if the gentleman had said the following.

Your physical actions should not be invariably linked to any single phase of your core movement. You should not form a training habit of always connecting body movement to any particular activity.

For example, imagine you are in a fight and need to punch. It could happen at a moment when you are running backwards. But if your prior training has created a strong habit of punching only when you are putting translational, compression, or rotational forces INTO your motion, you may be delayed or confused in your response, or you'll simply fail to execute a strong punch. Habitual dependencies like that can lead to interruption of movement; stoppage of movement; hesitation in movement; loss of energy; loss of balance; and other harmful results.

See what I mean?

You can't violate the rules of physics. You can create options, but you can't do something with nothing or less than nothing.

There ARE rules to the game. Just don't get fixated on one of them. Simplistic approaches give you limited results.

But no methods to choose from can give you nothing at all when you need it most.

- Bill

fivedragons · Post by **fivedragons** » Sat Mar 31, 2007 3:41 am

"For example, imagine you are in a fight and need to punch. It could happen at a moment when you are running backwards. But if your prior training has created a strong habit of punching only when you are putting translational, compression, or rotational forces INTO your motion,"

Yep.

Stryke · Post by **Stryke** » Sat Mar 31, 2007 4:19 am

For example, imagine you are in a fight and need to punch. It could happen at a moment when you are running backwards. But if your prior training has created a strong habit of punching only when you are putting translational, compression, or rotational forces INTO your motion,"

you mean you guys cant punch while going backwards using translational compression and rotational forces ?

you should drill that !!!