and this is how the world will end?

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Postby Bill Glasheen » Sun Jul 29, 2007 9:55 pm

Stryke wrote:
Well NZ doesnt seem to have a bee shortage even though it`s had veroa mite problems


Varroa mites don't appear to be the problem. That was mentioned in the article about organic beekeeping, but again - it wasn't the issue. At least according to the article Dana cited (and other sources as well), the culprit may be a virulent strain of nosema ceranae, which afflicts the Asiatic honeybee.

Are the NZ bees resistant to this parasite? If not, then our agricultural system will just be spending good money after bad. If so, then there's big money ahead for the New Zealand bee industry.

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Postby Akil Todd Harvey » Fri Aug 24, 2007 12:34 pm

A question for the biologists in the group........


Is there any species of animal that does not go through population fluctuations?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!


Exponential growth or even ordinary growth of populations is often follwoed by years of DIE back or population SHRINKAGE.........



What was the plague in Europe in the middle ages, but a simple die back of the population (too many people to be supported by the existing set of infrastructures)?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!


Wars are often historically a response to a shortage of resources needed to keep populations alive.......in the animal kingdom, while there are no wars, there is plenty of aggression and fighting for precious resources..........



I have been feeding the birds in my yard for months massive amounts of food (there should have been plenty for everyone), but there was still some shining examples of aggression (animals arent always as nice as some would have you believe)....




While i dont look forward to a die back of the human population any time soon, the stresses we face as a species, as massive population increases have occurred in the last few centuries via technological advances, die backs do not surprise me in any way (they are simply indicative of the FACT that many countries have OVERPOPULATED and that overpopulation was possible specifically due to technologocial advances)........

if our technological advances can keep up with population growth, there will be little stress and fewer wars and die backs, but if population increases faster than technological growth, then disaster and miresy will await large numbers of people.........


There are some liberal guilt mongers who would have you believe that those of us in the west are terrible people cuz we use too many resources (these same liberal guilt mongers - of which i was one for too long - are very forgiving to the developing world cuz those are the countries with the greatest OVERPOPULATION problems)......

There could be no massive starvation problems in the developing world that could be blamed on the west until the West had created a masssive surplus of food that they shared with the rest of the developing world.........


some cry foul that the use of corn to make ethanol would drive up the cost of food worldwide and lead to massive starvation......While i do not look forward to lots of people starving in the developed world (or anywhere), it was PRECISELY the Low cost of food that led to the population EXPLOSION in the first place...........
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Postby Akil Todd Harvey » Sun Aug 26, 2007 12:23 pm

Western farmers have already gone through what farmers in the developing world are going through..........the push toward larger farms.........



The vast majority of small farmers in this country have already been pushed off their land (and the developing world benefitted from that through decreased grain prices that enabled them to have a population explosion (that combined with the medicines that were developed in the west to prevent childhood diseases helped create exponetial growth of populations in the developing world that just didnt occur in the developed world).............



small farmers in the developed world didnt benefit much (as did those small farmers in the developing world as they were pushed off their land)........

I am NOT saying that i like it or i am happy with it, I am saying it happened to us and it is hapening to them.....no conspiracy, just evolution ..........


we in the developed world already got pushed off of our farms and forced into the city.......now it occurs in the developing world.....perchance it will slow down their growth rates which are clearly unsustainable.......
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Postby Bill Glasheen » Mon Aug 27, 2007 1:03 am

Adam

Clearly we humans aren't yet in equilibrium with our environment. The fact that our numbers are still growing shows that. So where will it all end up? It's difficult to say.

There's something to be said for human ingenuity, and drive towards productivity. With each generation, we learn to do more with less. But that can't go on forever in this closed environment. Already on the energy front, we're engaging in "deficit spending." We're consuming energy that it took millions of years to create. When that is all gone, the whole "global warming" thing (if it exists as a human-driven thing) will seem like no big deal. We're going to have to find new ways to get the energy we need to survive. Perhaps those limitations may one day define our ceiling.

We are however not the only beings on this planet. Other microbial life forms will find it easier and easier to prey on us as our numbers increase. The job of the CDC and other such entities gets more difficult all the time. Another 1918 flu epidemic (H1N1) will one day hit us so fast and so hard that it will humble us all. And let's not forget that this particular bug hit the strongest and healthiest the hardest.

Time will tell.

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