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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:43 am 
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http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=622_1327686128

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:47 am 
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What do you observe that is disturbing?

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:48 am 
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What tactics come to mind?

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:51 am 
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I wonder what prompted this attack? The victims all had hats on like they were Jewish, but maybe they posed a threat to this guy. It's hard to know the motivation. If there wasn't one and it was an anti semitic attack, then I guess if you part of a minority you just keep aware 24/7


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 5:30 pm 
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Good observations...this happened in Israel. As to motivation...who really knows what the 'readout' was.

These 'tunneling' incidents are not uncommon...it brings to mind the one Laird and his family came up against in an underground subway passage in Canada, and how the quick thinking of Laird with the right 'words' and concealed weapon [knife] back up...saved the day.

Alleys are best avoided at all cost...but if absolutely necessary...one must walk in 'condition orange' [deadly violence impending] every step of the way...and able to deploy the right weapons at close quarters battle.

The very best weapon and 'tactical deployment' of such is this itemImage
Load this with + P _rounds...and carry it concealed in your jacket pocket or pants pocket...if you need to walk 'tunnels'...and wrap your hand around it.

The 'snubby' is hammerless so it can be fired from your pocket at contact range with an assailant_without jamming.

No need to pull the gun out of your pocket at all.

An alternative is this Image

http://store.kimberamerica.com/Products ... fault.aspx

You keep it in your right hand[almost totally obscuring its shape] to your ear as if talking on a cell phone, finger inside the trigger guard...and you might just get a chance to escape serious injury or death.

The biggest problem is that if someone wants to really kill you...he will always find a way to get to you while unaware.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:56 pm 
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Well if you know this sort of stuff IMHO then you think in terms of the " prisoners Dilema", which is what is the best possible outcome for me?? so if I thought there was a threat I must react very quickly ,before the threat became a reality...........then , surprisingly for me I (would use a force continuum)....so I would inflict a minimum of damage....the pepper gun would be great.if the guy was approaching me innocently and I got stressed then I would incapictate without killing him......so if he was dangerous he would get hurt and if he wasn't dangerous he wouldn't get hurt too much :lol:

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These 'tunneling' incidents are not uncommon...it brings to mind the one Laird and his family came up against in an underground subway passage in Canada, and how the quick thinking of Laird with the right 'words' and concealed weapon [knife] back up...saved the day.


well I hope it wasn't a cold steel vaquero XL or
http://www.filofiel.com/tiendaonline/jj ... -1747.html

Few can compete with the latin for the love of steel, although they exist 8)


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:25 am 
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http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=fa0_1286260320

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:28 am 
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 2:39 pm 
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What scares me the most was there seems to be no attempt to rob--that guy was just stabbing people to stab them. It would not have occured to me that someone might just walk up and attack you. I would have assumed that attacks would occur in context with a robbery attempt.

None of the 3 men were ready for the attack and they didn't do much to help each other after it started. Not saying I would do any better, just pointing out that numbers don't always mean "strength."

I was also struck by the guy coming back to stab the dude on the ground. I would have assumed that an attacker would be long gone after a successful attack---that he would come back was unexpected--to me anyway.

The guy on his back seems to have be able to keep him at bay with kicks for a time--until he came back.

Oddly I just watched on TV, just yesterday, someone saying they would rather be attacked with a knife than a gun. While her counter part was saying if she were attacked she would rather have a gun. Wonder if I should forward the former girl that clip.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:45 pm 
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I think that it's hard, near on impossible to understand people's motivation and intent. When I used to work in crime you'd get to see all sorts of attacks on people.sometimes somebody would think that they had been disrespected( Dissed) sometimes the person attacking had mental problems or was on drugs.
You can quantify it a little, if you know the people involved i.e if you work in law and order, you can know criminals and criminal families , but there are so many of what I would call " Black Swan events" ( not my term,I borrowed it from Nassim Taleb) that to be perfectly sure of an outcome is never a certainty.
People put forward theories but as they say "in theory ,practise and theory are the same.In practise they are not" you just have to be as vigilant as you can, if you feel something is wrong then it probably is. I remember years ago on this forum I told the tale of the local Asian shopkeeper in my area, he was a nice man who used to give my kids sweets for free.I left the area but one day I went back into his shop, and he said that he hadn't seenme for awhile, I told him that I had moved and he said " You are very wise my friend, this area has gone really bad with robberies and drugs"....a couple of months later I heard that he had been attacked in his shop and hit over the head with a hammer, he never fully recovered...........and yet he had already identified the problem.I guess he just thought that it didn't affect him :cry:


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:50 pm 
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Good post Ray and so true.

There is a tendency to go to 'denial stages' in most of us...as though for some concocted reason we are 'immune' personally...

and denial usually leads to paralysis of some sort.

~~

In the last clip we see an 'association president' thinking he is very smart in taking it upon himself to approach three noisy troublemakers outside the condo complex...to disperse them...instead of calling the police.

The temptation to face such vermin by yourself is great at times...somehow we all think we are 'tough guys' in one way or another...and we will not be 'punked out' ...the truth is usually very impending...and it is usually due to not really knowing the dynamics of violence, as Rory Miller points out.

the clip shows a good way to quickly find out how tough we really are...

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:06 pm 
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CXT
Quote:
None of the 3 men were ready for the attack and they didn't do much to help each other after it started. Not saying I would do any better, just pointing out that numbers don't always mean "strength."

I was also struck by the guy coming back to stab the dude on the ground. I would have assumed that an attacker would be long gone after a successful attack---that he would come back was unexpected--to me anyway.


True. Most people are not used to the shocks of sudden violence, especially when perpetrated by psychos with a weapon...

So we will freeze or run or do all sort of things that will befuddle us and haunt us for the rest of our lives...

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:25 pm 
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This could well be a hate attack; the man with the blade seems to be different than the men with the hats. Sometimes the way we dress can attract violence in disturbed people.

Yes, the 'buddies' took off leaving a friend behind, according to what is perceived, who knows how badly hurt the buddies were.

But one would think no matter how badly hurt, you stick around…stick together…

But panic and shock take their toll every time…especially after getting stabbed.

As to tactics…anytime you get funneled by a tunnel…you are in danger…anywhere…

There is a long 'funnel tunnel' in a local shopping mall leading to restrooms. There have been some fights occasioned by 'shouldering' someone …yet I don't see a more active security patrol in the area.

The few times I have used it…there is always the pepper blaster concealed in my hand, finger on the trigger. There may be security cameras in the corridor…so one must be careful at what he does…

Now look at the beginning of the attack at 00.06…what kind of response action move would be wise to practice out of Uechi Ryu?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:59 pm 
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I can't speak for uechi, maybe a wa-uke?........it's a pre determined attack, and designed to be sneeky. You don't really need to study a martial art to think of that type of attack, but devending against it is hard....I would move like I was taught in Aiki.the attack is semi circular, so I would complete the circle and strike circulalry when I did it.hopefully like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lo5Na1x6 ... r_embedded

and who said that a bitch slap wasn't a classical technique 8)


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