Analysis of How to Train for Reality

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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Van Canna » Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:38 pm

Good stuff guys.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Van Canna » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:01 pm

I agree 100% with Van that we need to ingrain a few really solid moves that we do thousands of times so that they are instinctive and immediate.


Well when we think of it, the simpler the better,especially when it has been proven over time that the more stuff/styles/techniques we have practiced, the more confusion there will be in response action.

It is like someone attending dozens of 'seminars' a year, performing some moves for an hour or so, then thinking those moves will surface by instinct.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Van Canna » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:12 pm

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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Josann » Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:50 pm

Van Canna wrote:http://www.gutterfighting.org/forwarddrive.html


Love Cestari's simple ,yet practical techniques.Many of the tactics aren't too far off from seisan if you are open minded.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby jorvik » Sat Jan 19, 2013 11:41 am

I think that you need consistencey in your overall game plan. You need to think it through before hand so that if anything happens you can stick to plan
For example if you are going to use CQB techniques, which were designed to kill people in a time of warfare, are you going to wait for the cops so you can tell them your version of events, or just quietly disappear? and that's always assuming that you can disappear you may be caught on CCTV. Also it's rather difficult to say you were in fear of your life if you use polished kung fu or karate techniques, because, if questioned, that is the first thing that will be brought up.
I think that you need to develop different stratagies for different situations. some times it may be best to just disappear, say nothing. The police have a hard enough time finding criminals who have committed numerous crimes, and have previous convictions and their photograph and details on file
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Josann » Sat Jan 19, 2013 11:57 am

The more I look at "styles" and "systems' the more I see that all good martial arts and combatives have more in common than not. Here is an example from shorin that is from their seisan, but right out of our seichin:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlDNIlIqF90

Lot of stuff we practice in this as well in seisan. From combatives:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKN-Ub_XaJ0

Here's a good use of a forearm that has done conditioning for years:

http://vimeo.com/36996918

I'm sure other guys can find tons as well.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Van Canna » Sat Jan 19, 2013 1:57 pm

Thanks Josann. Excellent clips which show techniques inherent in Uechi practice...simple effective_

And Morrison and Blauer show the concepts and moves that would mostly work.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Van Canna » Sat Jan 19, 2013 1:59 pm

Ray,

Good thoughts.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Van Canna » Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:27 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlDNIlIqF90

This is good, we should be practicing some of this as, try as we might not to get grabbed, there will betimes when it will/might happen, at a party, club etc.

But I don't like to teach much against grabs, as subconsciously one might program the 'wait for the grab before I counter' _

I find it better to concentrate on sensing the grab coming and using the ghosting, evasive, techniques of getting off the X...

Suarez
Defending The X is the first reactive option, and probably the least desirable as it is the most tenuous. It involves holding your ground and fighting from your existing position, probably because you have no distance advantage (he is just outside of arm's reach), no spatial advantage (you do not have the option of moving off his line of attack), and no initiative advantage (you are reactive, not having anticipated and prepared). While this is certainly an unenviable place to be, we cannot ignore the possibility of being there. If so, our first consideration, after the fight begins, will be to gain an advantage either in the spatial or interval areas.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Van Canna » Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:29 pm

Moving Off The X.

The X of course is the intended target's current position.

By employing various movement methods, one can evade an adversary's initial attack and counter him before he can recover. Generally a reactive concept, it is usually most applicable when the operator is in a poor position with regards to initiative, but has some distance available as well as some space available. And these do not need to be extreme as one can apply the get off the x concept in a hallway with the proper techniques.

By understanding these concepts, and organizing your training around them, the speed with which you are able to perceive the appropriate response and put it to use will be faster. And that will increase your chances of prevailing in the fight.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Van Canna » Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:36 pm

I understand getting off the X from the defenders point of view. But what does the bad guy think you are doing? Does the BG (obviously only at first) think you are running away and calling him/them the victor? In other words, does blasting off the X look agressive or submissive from the BG's point of view? Does blasting off the X in the direction of the adversary increase your appearance of aggression or is the BG mostly befuddled (major reset of the OODA loop) as you invade his sense of security.



The reaction differs with direction.
From my research,turning and running away, as in to 5,6, or 7 o'clock, actually seems to most likely provoke a predator vs prey reaction with the bad guy giving chase to the good guy.

You can change is loop by moving away. You DESTROY his loop by attacking him.

This is actually two questions about your perception of the bad guy. It is either about ego or tactics. If our own ego is under control then it becomes a tactical question. What matters concerning the bad guys thinking/ego is that it gives you a tactical advantage either to draw him in where you want him or persuade him to cease the attack.

He probably expects you to either 'freeze,' 'backpeddle,' or turn and run. If you're with family, running's out of the question for most whether armed or not.

The untrained will most likely freeze in a state shock or denial, "this cant be happening!"

When my wife was in her early twenties, she was the victim of road rage. The car she "cut off," passed her and at a stop light; several thugs pulled her out of her car window by her hair and beat her. This was in the 1980's.

It honestly comes down to you recognizing what is happening BEFORE you are looking up the muzzle of his gun or inspecting the shiny edge of his knife.
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby jorvik » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:51 pm

My old Dad told me a tale ,years back when he was in the airforce an argument broke out between an upper class type officer and some other fellow, the officer said that he didn't want any trouble and that he would buy the guy a drink " what do you want old chap? the chap asked for a pint of bitter, but when he raised it to his mouth and took the first swallow..............our officer, palm heeld the pint into his face 8O
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Stryke » Sat Jan 19, 2013 8:41 pm

Movement is huge , I teach getting of the x , but more specifically I teach merging and joing with the opponent .

there was discussion on yeilding and going back , the real trick is merging(yeilding) and entering, even if its while moving backwards , you are closing while going backwards.

the opponent has to enter to attack , if you can merge you let him , yeild and roll around his force and he puts you in control.

The oponent thinks hes acheiving what hes doing , you get control of the joing mass centre because hes reaching and your base is under his .

its is a contimuim of skill , you first begin my opposing force , you progress to meeting force , you then progress to blending with the force , and eventually you can even lead there intention .

principles are far more applicable than technique , the more specific the principle the more general the application .

Pick a style , this is common in any style , at some point the relationship has to join , at the beginner level the two battering rams colide , at mastery its seemless .

the more specific the principle , the more general the application

So many look at kata as what your doing to your opponent , movement wise I think fols should take time to consider that maybe its what the opponents doing to you . this is where the Hapv can creep in , maybe a Sanchin draw is a Sanchin yeild sometimes .

uechi is a circle , orientation to force , position , cover and entry .
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby jorvik » Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:52 am

Quote
"Movement is huge , I teach getting of the x , but more specifically I teach merging and joing with the opponent ."

Yeah I agree. When somebody attacks you they have the advantage of moving first, they act and you must react.However if you move as they move then they will have to realign themselves to continue the attack, they are now reacting and you are acting, so you have the advantage

this guy shows it very well

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIu8DY-EH6w
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Re: Analysis of How to Train for Reality

Postby Josann » Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:53 am

Here's some scientific explaination that supports Van's comments on having a few go to moves for defense:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0hJveJ8Hp0

Makes sense to me and supports the very deep, yet narrow study that is Uechi Ryu. Many guys are system jumpers and have a lot of time in different styles but never really ingrain any one thing i.e. "jack of all trades, master of none" syndrome. I think uechi and some cross training in a grappling or ju jitsu system makes sense, at least for those of us committed to uechi.Beginners would do great with some boxing and wrestling training.
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