Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby hthom » Sun Sep 15, 2013 4:54 pm

Stryke
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWQrkFErRuc
anyone see any Uechi in the positions?anyone see any Uechi in the positions?


I kind of like this guy. I recognized his voice before recognizing him. Hadn't seen him for a while. He is getting a little gray like the rest of us. Just don't understand why he changes his name so much. Jim Grover, Crucible, now Kelly McCann. Actually quite a few of his techniques do look similar to some Uechi moves, but then, quite a lot of styles do have movements that look similar in many ways.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby Rick Wilson » Sun Sep 15, 2013 4:59 pm

Rick Wilson - http://wpd-rc.com/
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby hthom » Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:26 pm

Rick


I like it too. watched it many times because it always seem to bring back old memories when I used to hang around in Boston's Combat Zone.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby Feur » Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:48 pm

I have been constantly finding Uechi in other combative systems. I use to discover new fighting techniques in training in the clinch etc.etc. and then months later I'd stumble across a video clip of some guy selling my secrete technique of doom. Turns out their are only so many ways to skin a cat and it's all been done before. But it's always good to discover your getting it right.

I've gone off and got very involved in Tactical shooting etc. I've trained different weapons platforms, I've worked at many ranges ground fighting clinch fighting throwing striking etc. I'm not the best fighter in the world but I'm very capable of harming folks. Winning fights is not the challenge.

Training for physical conflict has been part of my life for many decades. This is probably always going to be part of me. However it's not the big challenge. The challenge in life is the human interaction the verbal skill. How to engage people and prevail without beating the snot out of them.

Time for a look inward. Geoff Thompson has a great take on what I'm trying to say in this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHEgMf0Wr-Q
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby hthom » Sun Sep 15, 2013 6:19 pm

This might be a duplicated submittal. I thought I submitted this last night but it wasn't here this morning. Umm, I must have punched the wrong button or, as usual, said some inappropriate stuff. I am softening my words and resubmitting, hope it will go through this time.

Laird
Henry has generated a very active thread here. It's encouraging to see a Uechi senior question the validity ----- etc. -- I'm surprised to see him back pedal and attempt to close Pandora's box? ---- etc.-- You do the Uechi world a great service by posting clips of variations of Bunkai as it gets many thinking about their kata and how it might be used. Everyone needs to ponder if their techniques would stand up in a real violent confrontation


Thank you for your kind words, Laird. Yes I back pedaled. I do have the tendency of saying inappropriate stuff sometimes, or saying them inappropriately. I tent to forget that I am an old timer Uechi practitioner and a Hanshi, there are things I should say differently if I were to say them at all.

As to the YouTube video clips you mentioned, I would give GEM credits for encouraging me to look outside of the box and think of alternative applications. The clips might have become locker room
jokes (I know of at least one occasion) but I just wanted to come up with some alternative applications that I feel are more realistic without deviating from the Kata movements.

Stryke questioned at what point does evolution demand changes. As mentioned above, GEM does allow flexibility on performing the Bunkai's. I forgot his exact words but something like: Up to and including the Shodan test, the students need to do the standard Bunkai's, but after Shodan he/she may (or should?) experiment alternative applications. A good reason the Bunkai's are difficult to change across the board is the necessity of standardization. An example here: During one of my student's Nidan test in a Summer Camp I did my modified Sensan Bunkai with him because I wanted to take the opportunity to demonstrate the modified approach based more on modern day street fighting. But, due to the deviation from the standard, no one else there knows the movements.

I am signing off from this thread. Great information from everyone. Thank you all.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby Van Canna » Sun Sep 15, 2013 8:30 pm

Rick Wilson wrote:I always liked this clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1R5XMSXsCQ


Yup, it is the brachial stun at its best.

There a subtle way for Uechi people to deliver a similar strike by using the so called 'fishtail' wrists blocks/strikes.

Once unintentionally, at camp I dropped a student, while demonstrating a 'fish tail' strike with my right hand to the side of his neck, not hard at all, but with a relaxed heavy hand plus time on target.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby Van Canna » Sun Sep 15, 2013 9:12 pm

Time for a look inward. Geoff Thompson has a great take on what I'm trying to say in this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHEgMf0Wr-Q


Great clip, Laird and so poignant. And he even mentions that 'techniques' are really a personal development...and this is _unfortunately_ a common reason for personal strife within individual practitioners and associations, of course.

That, plus the 'negativity' of violence inside of us, as he puts it_ can make life a living hell for so many.

Deep inside, I think we all know that it is doubtful that you'll find all the answers in one place... yet...

So many of us can so easily be led into a form of restrictive thinking of the strict adherence to "historical or traditional" practice with no room for individual 'deviation' if you will...not even in application...while studying under some teachers.

Reason why I am so glad I was able to post the information related to Mark Breslford by Masters Uechi and Nakahodo.

Once shown traditional movements applied in a certain way does not mean that you are only "allowed" to use that motion in exactly the same way! You have to apply the concepts and techniques of the katas in the way that works best for you, and reflects the person you are.

Naturally, other people, being different, may not always agree with what you show them and viceversa...and we must understand and accept this reality.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby Van Canna » Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:17 am

Image

The brachial stun we see in that clip where the pimp ends up doing a dance...is interesting to dissect as to the why and how it happens.

The Brachial Plexus Origin, which is a nerve bundle located in the side of the neck, is comprised of the median, radial, and ulnar nerves (these travel down and feed into the arm).

Hitting this nerve bundle really zaps the electrical system, and can cause a stunning effect that could very well cause an adversary to collapse onto the ground.
An older version of the Army Field Manual on combatives (FM 21-150) describes it this way:

A sharp blow to the side of the neck causes unconsciousness by shock to the carotid artery, jugular vein, and vagus nerve. For maximum effect, the blow should be focused below and slightly in front of the ear. A less powerful blow causes involuntary muscle spasms and intense pain. The side of the neck is one of the best targets to use to drop an opponent immediately or to disable him temporarily to finish him later.

But since we are discussing this technique on my forum, I feel obligated to point to a caveat:

If you strike someone over forty, there may well be plaque in the carotid artery that might become dislodged...think...stroke/death. Or the blow can also cause an aneurysm leading to sudden death.

An aneurysm occurs when part of a blood vessel (artery) or cardiac chamber swells, - either the blood vessel is damaged or there is a weakness in the wall of the blood vessel. As blood pressure builds up it balloons out at its weakest point. The swelling can be quite small or very large - when large it tends to extend along the blood vessel. As the aneurysm grows there is a greater risk of rupture - this can lead to severe hemorrhage, and other complications, including sudden death.



The strike is delivered using either the back of the hand, the palm heel, the inner forearm or the outer forearm. The bony structures of the wrist and hand are never used for striking unless it is a deadly force situation.

The forearm versions of this strike are used when in extreme close quarters, as the arm extension required for the backhand and palm heel is not feasible.

~~~~

So I wanted everyone reading this discussion, be very aware of the potential complications of such a strike that can put you in jail and deplete you financially.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby hthom » Mon Sep 16, 2013 7:01 pm

The brachial stun we see in that clip where the pimp ends up doing a dance...is interesting to dissect as to the why and how it happens.

Good stuff. Thanks, Van.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby fivedragons » Tue Sep 17, 2013 1:48 am

Stryke: "But there's lots of layers to the onion."

And then Laird posted a link that made me think about how the onion we are peeling is really ourselves. (
"the onion is me") And once the layers have all been peeled and there is no onion left, we find out that there was never an onion.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby fivedragons » Tue Sep 17, 2013 2:01 am

You read my mind. :lol: I tried to fit that in, but gave up. :lol:

8)

http://youtu.be/f61EeXmcXRU
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby Van Canna » Tue Sep 17, 2013 2:10 pm

Here's another sad ongoing 'situation' and example of how violence can pay you a visit...http://www.infowars.com/i-hate-white-pe ... al-attack/

and the question to the self is how well prepared do we think we are in spite of our training assumptions.
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby jorvik » Tue Sep 17, 2013 8:50 pm

Well, As I have often said you can't predict violence,. you just can't say how it will go down.but folks like to believe that they can :roll: .Poor fool YOU.
As to KATA...it's a toy .play with it if you want.it's not real. Think about it, break it down , it is something very simple ,made very complex, with all sorts of connotations and explanations......BUUUUUUUUT violence is very simple.....I like this sort of stuff

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZg4mqc7n-A




, it's what I do now, I've rejectred all the "sticking hands" and "pushing hands " stuff.now I punch bags and don't listen to fools :P ....don't need kata don't need philosophy,,,,,,,,,,,I need Poor Bob to check my reality out.I can't say how usefull this tool is 8)
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby Feur » Wed Sep 18, 2013 12:31 am

Stryke wrote:8) very astute 8)

peeling onions often causes tears :lol: :lol:


or pain or grown men soiling them selves. :mrgreen:
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Re: Kata Movement Interpretation- Does it work?

Postby fivedragons » Wed Sep 18, 2013 6:08 pm

I just realized that Feur and I actually have a lot in common:

He's out there, kicking a$$ and taking names, while I'm in here, dancing by myself and playing games.
He teaches karate to warriors, while I watch dvd's of warriors teaching karate.
He uses people as punching bags, while I use punching bags for people.
He preys on large animals with a gun, while I was preyed on by a large animal with a gun.
He showed his knife to a criminal and scared the schit out of him, while a criminal showed his knife to me and scared the schit out of me.
He trains to fuk up multiple attackers by punching and kicking them, while I train because I was fuked up by multiple attackers, who punched and kicked me.

:lol:
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