Absolutely worth another shot! We tend to get lost in the stereotypes no matter how much we protest otherwise! Fact: Men will never understand what women really think - and women will never understand what men really think! Dispute that! Try your hardest! All we can do is recognize that hard cold fact of life and try to make do - and when it comes to survival - it is imperative to know what signals we are sending. Sure - we can p*** and moan all we ant about how we should have the right to wear whatever we want to whenever we want etc. - and should have the right to walk around unmolested - yeah - we should! But should we, as someone said somewhere in these threads - dangle a steak in front of a starving tiger? How smart is that? The world is NOT perfect - neither are people - and if we want to survive we must adapt to the world that's out there - not to say we can't change anything - we can - but we can't change the predator - he's already made up his mind! Why play into his pre-determined definition of victim???
Please read again:
<blockquote>the feelings outlined by Mary, and by Lori “but I do bristle a bit at the attitudes that spark the very need for a thread like that.” underscore what Animal Mac Young says: i.e.,
“Despite great advances in breaking gender roles in this culture, there remain fundamental issues between how men and women think. Several books are available on the subject that explains these differences. It is as wrong for men to assume they know how women think as it is for women to assume they know how men think. Knowing the extent of this difference between male and female psyche is important since much of it is unconsciously assumed. “
No offense to any woman or man reading this, but when you think about it, there are very few of us, male or female, enlightened enough to know the difference. It takes a very perceptive mind, in addition to a well-schooled mind, and a great deal of emotional intelligence.
Worth another shot:
Know what signals you are sending
{Mac Young}
Gilbert-sensei wrote:
the main thing is the thought is in you.
Lets take this “thought” concept further. What thoughts does anyone think are in the mind of panther’s “friend” in rationalizing the apparent liberties he is taking with panther’s wife? What thoughts do you think are in the “friend’s” mind as to the kind of man panther is? What thoughts are in panther’s mind as to his friend’s thoughts about him [panther] as a man? What thoughts are in panther wife’s mind as to what kind of men both her husband and the “friend” are manifesting themselves to be in this situation?
“I know she's also concerned because he's ex-military, brags about how he's never been put down in a fight”
What is the “friend” thinking in finding it necessary to brag like this to panther’s wife?
Such thoughts, if put down in the written word would fill volumes. Believe it or not such brain ruminations take the form of “toxic thoughts” which slowly permeate all aspects of an intimate relationship, including the “bedroom”! Goleman writes that thoughts of righteous indignation, such as a perceived emotional slap, continually fuel anger and hurt, something women have trouble understanding at times, because they have no clue as to how a man thinks, as Mac Young points out.
Goleman also writes that these “manufactured thoughts” trip the neural alarm system triggering an ongoing emotional highjacking on continual basis.
Goleman reflects that there are two emotional realities in a couple, his and hers.
The roots of these emotional differences are in part biological and in part the result of the separate emotional world boys and girls inhabit when growing up.
In spite of all the talk and the “huffy” reactions, it is the rare man or woman who is able to reconcile these subtle differences. </blockquote>
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Van Canna
Worth another shot
Moderator: Available
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JOHN THURSTON
- Posts: 2445
- Joined: Sat Nov 28, 1998 6:01 am
- Location: MARSHFIELD, MA. USA
- Contact:
Worth another shot
Hello:
Well, I certainly seemed to have missed many of the main points of this thread, however, a few points may be worthwhile.
1. Taking "Liberties" with another's Wife.
In "our" culture, for better or worse, this is a betrayal. I note that sometimes a husband gives motive and/or express or implied consent (the swinging crowd). Regardless of such, 'taking liberties' can create explosive situations. True story:
A friend gave such "permission" regarding his Wife. Everyone involved thought the matter could be 'handled maturely'. There was a reason for this granting of permission which I will not go into.
Nonetheless, severe jealousy and acrimony arose, and the person who received 'permission' committed suicide.
Apparently he retained residual notions of 'honor' (being an older man, ex-military officer, and the resident of a REAL small town) that assailed him, fatally so.
This 'sexual freedom' can still turn deadly in our culture.
In "Kablloona" Gontran De Poncin's Non Fiction work about the Inuit of the Canadian northwest, he noted that that (yes the stories were true) that the Inuit shared everything---including the obvious.
A 'white' investigator of an Inuit murder assigned 'infidelity' as a motive to one case. The 'perp' denied this as a motive. However, although it was permissible to 'lend' one's spouse out, it was considered less that 'generous' not to 'return' the spouse. This 'failure to return a spouse' was the real murder motive.
I our culture, one takes vows as an enforcement of what is, essentially, wife rationing.
Nonetheless a vow is a vow and, in many instances the release from the vow creates a dangerous situation.
2. Of course it would seem that men and women think differently.
The wives in the foregoing situations did not seriously consider suicide or murder. But perhaps that is just happenstance.
JT
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Well, I certainly seemed to have missed many of the main points of this thread, however, a few points may be worthwhile.
1. Taking "Liberties" with another's Wife.
In "our" culture, for better or worse, this is a betrayal. I note that sometimes a husband gives motive and/or express or implied consent (the swinging crowd). Regardless of such, 'taking liberties' can create explosive situations. True story:
A friend gave such "permission" regarding his Wife. Everyone involved thought the matter could be 'handled maturely'. There was a reason for this granting of permission which I will not go into.
Nonetheless, severe jealousy and acrimony arose, and the person who received 'permission' committed suicide.
Apparently he retained residual notions of 'honor' (being an older man, ex-military officer, and the resident of a REAL small town) that assailed him, fatally so.
This 'sexual freedom' can still turn deadly in our culture.
In "Kablloona" Gontran De Poncin's Non Fiction work about the Inuit of the Canadian northwest, he noted that that (yes the stories were true) that the Inuit shared everything---including the obvious.
A 'white' investigator of an Inuit murder assigned 'infidelity' as a motive to one case. The 'perp' denied this as a motive. However, although it was permissible to 'lend' one's spouse out, it was considered less that 'generous' not to 'return' the spouse. This 'failure to return a spouse' was the real murder motive.
I our culture, one takes vows as an enforcement of what is, essentially, wife rationing.
Nonetheless a vow is a vow and, in many instances the release from the vow creates a dangerous situation.
2. Of course it would seem that men and women think differently.
The wives in the foregoing situations did not seriously consider suicide or murder. But perhaps that is just happenstance.
JT
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Allen M.
Worth another shot
I never visualized woman as a piece of steak or man as a starving tiger, Lori. I guess women and men DO think differently! 
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Allen, Home: http://www.ury2k.com/pulse mirror: http://home.ici.net/~uechi/
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Allen, Home: http://www.ury2k.com/pulse mirror: http://home.ici.net/~uechi/
Worth another shot
Lori,
I suppose you are right about the "steak and tiger" and to not present yourself as a target for the predator.
But What about the innocent women and children who are leaving the library during the day or the grocery store or the mall? Women who send no mixed signals nor wear revealing clothes? And find themselves in the wrong place at the wrong time? And I must bring up this topic while we are talking about the difference between men and women? Do you think pornography plays a part in the crimes against women and young girls? One example is at a public library in Michigan I believe several men would visit the public library daily and pull up pornographic sites (even moaning out loud). One particular day, after viewing pornographic images, one of the men raped a 10 year old girl who was in the library.
And there has been much conversation on teaching our daughters not to dress improperly and not send any mixed signals, but what about teaching our sons to respect women and their wishes? What about even if you thought a girl had intentions, when she said no, to respect that?
Kristy
I suppose you are right about the "steak and tiger" and to not present yourself as a target for the predator.
But What about the innocent women and children who are leaving the library during the day or the grocery store or the mall? Women who send no mixed signals nor wear revealing clothes? And find themselves in the wrong place at the wrong time? And I must bring up this topic while we are talking about the difference between men and women? Do you think pornography plays a part in the crimes against women and young girls? One example is at a public library in Michigan I believe several men would visit the public library daily and pull up pornographic sites (even moaning out loud). One particular day, after viewing pornographic images, one of the men raped a 10 year old girl who was in the library.
And there has been much conversation on teaching our daughters not to dress improperly and not send any mixed signals, but what about teaching our sons to respect women and their wishes? What about even if you thought a girl had intentions, when she said no, to respect that?
Kristy
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David Elkins
- Posts: 1089
- Joined: Fri Jan 15, 1999 6:01 am
Worth another shot
How about vegetarians? 
Seriously, sexual aggression is just that and has little to nothing to do with attractiveness. 80 year old women are raped as well as 14 year old boys. Kristy has a good point about porno. Along with violent video games, 'zines, and other expression of the mass media it serves to objectify people (especially I think women) and desensitize to the brutal realities of violence. How about the sense of entitlement that kids have nowadays..."I want therefore I should have." Just my humble opinion that these are social problems and reflective of a brutal and dehumanizing social structure with little real concern for improving human conditions.
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Good Training,
David
Uechi Ryu West
Seriously, sexual aggression is just that and has little to nothing to do with attractiveness. 80 year old women are raped as well as 14 year old boys. Kristy has a good point about porno. Along with violent video games, 'zines, and other expression of the mass media it serves to objectify people (especially I think women) and desensitize to the brutal realities of violence. How about the sense of entitlement that kids have nowadays..."I want therefore I should have." Just my humble opinion that these are social problems and reflective of a brutal and dehumanizing social structure with little real concern for improving human conditions.
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Good Training,
David
Uechi Ryu West
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Allen M.
Worth another shot
Must be that religions, moral values, and parenting are failing to the excitement of the media. What's discipline anymore, especially when your own kids can take you to court if you punish them (the PC words are "show them the consequences of their actions") where they can now show you the consequences of your actions.
Ah, we are deeply in the swill-pit of modern society and there is no way out except go for the ride!
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Allen, Home: http://www.ury2k.com/pulse mirror: http://home.ici.net/~uechi/
Ah, we are deeply in the swill-pit of modern society and there is no way out except go for the ride!
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Allen, Home: http://www.ury2k.com/pulse mirror: http://home.ici.net/~uechi/
