Schoolyard bullies

Dana Sheets · Post by **Dana Sheets** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 7:40 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Sexual harassment starts oung because children see how grown-ups relate. It grows because attitudes and behavior that create and condone harassment are winked at on playgrounds. We haven't taught most of our girls to stand up to bulying, sexual or otherwise, when they're young, as we mess with their instincts to protect themselves.
What could be more natural than defending oneself from unwanted attention? Why do we train our women not to defend themselves from assault, be it physical or emotional? It's socialization that says, "Boys will be boys" or "Boy chase, girls don't hit." And boys aren't "naturally" bullies; they must be trained to be so.
"Beauty Bites Beast"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Were any of the women and men here bullies in their youth??? Were you tormented by a bully? Male or female?

Dana

candan · Post by **candan** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 9:56 pm

http://cbc.ca/stories/2002/03/25/wesley020325 http://www.canada.com/halifax/specials/bully/ <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Two girls from her school were charged with uttering
threats. One of them was also accused of criminal
harassment. Their identities are protected because they
were prosecuted under Canada's Young Offenders Act.

The 16-year-old who was found guilty of both charges
Monday will undergo four to six weeks of assessments
before a judge imposes a sentence.

In her ruling, B.C. Provincial Court Judge Jill Rounthwaite
said that it was clear that one of the accused had
bullied Wesley repeatedly, giving the victim reason to
fear for her life.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Two interesting but sad cases of bullies, both involve girls as the bullies, one victim was a boy. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Some claim she extorted up to $80 a day from Fralick, who had
to resort to shoplifting to pay her for fear of being beaten.
Fralick was picked up for shoplifting at Sears in the Halifax
Shopping Centre on March 11, but never charged.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Both cases stirring up a lot of emotion <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> As Fralick’s family gathered at his graveside in Springville,
Pictou Co., yesterday afternoon, a police cruiser was parked in
front of a row of public housing units called “the pubs” in the
city’s west end, where the girl accused of harassing him lives.
Fralick also lived in the neighbourhood.

Two women out for a stroll said the girl was the one who
drove Fralick to suicide.

“She did it. She’s a thief and a liar,” said one of the women.
“They should put the little bitch in jail.”<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[This message has been edited by candan (edited April 26, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by candan (edited April 26, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by candan (edited April 26, 2002).]

Dana Sheets · Post by **Dana Sheets** » Sat Apr 27, 2002 12:35 am

so there will be more examples of women being bullies today than there were even five years ago.

And it wouldn't surprise me if the growing perception becomes that women bully more than boys. Why? Because a girl being a bully is new, different, fascinating, and, IMHO, long overdue.

Yes there will be backlash as women find their power. Yes, some will go too far. Yes, there are as many bad women as there are good women.

But we're taking hold of our own lives in a way we never have. And I doubt we'll let go.

But what brings someone to the point where by persecuting others they feel empowered? How can women identify that this kind of persecution is going on, and how can we teach our daughters to avoid it?

Do we teach children in martial arts classes this? Do we have an "anti-bully" lesson plan?

Colleen · Post by **Colleen** » Sun Apr 28, 2002 8:51 pm

Thought I'd reply to the original question proposed by Dana:

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote

Were any of the women and men here bullies in their youth??? Were you tormented by a bully? Male or female?

What I considered bullying as a kid wasn't fist fighting, in fact I only heard of/saw one fist fight through my entire school life. Now the verbal assaults, those were much more frequent... and most of them where from other little girls. I remember feeling devestated when I was taunted with 'fat and ugly' by a couple of girls. It plays with your head when you're 10 years old and I didn't know how to fight back. My first instinct was to kick and punch them, though.

I look back at pictures from when I was 10 years old and I was as thin as a rail. How the heck did I allow them to make me feel so bad for so long? From the age of 10 to about 18, I thought I was a big elephant..and I had never weighed more than 120 pounds during that time.

I think that when a woman (anyone in reality, but for the purpose of this discussion, I'm using women) is bullying as a kid, she's just refining her skills to be used in the future. It's not about finding your inner power, it's about finding some way to be nasty but not being called to the floor on it. Instead of a little girl taunting 'fat and ugly', as an adult she'd be more likely to say something like 'my, you certainly are testing the seams in your pants'. The meaning, you're getting fat...without having to say you're getting fat. Sneaky? Yes. Power? Only if you give it to her and let it affect you.

Bullying, to me, isn't about a kid finding their inner power or testing the limits, it's about making someone else feel bad so they can make themselves feel better. That's not real power, that's borrowed power.

uechiwoman · Post by **uechiwoman** » Sun Apr 28, 2002 11:22 pm

After I graduated from college I went to NY city to visit friends. We took a late afternoon cruise and chose seats on the open upper deck of the boat. Two rather drunk middle aged men also chose to sit on the upper deck. As soon as we left shore the two began to heckle, intimidate, make crude jokes and otherwise be as obnoxious as possible to all the people on the deck. It was interesting to watch what happened with different people around us. Some people immediately got up and went to the lower enclosed deck. Some people tried really hard to befriend the bullies. Some people ignored the whole situation. I exchanged words with both of them, in an attempt to have some peace. Friends went down to get the captain or similar in charge person to intervene. No one came to help and I remember at last threatening, not totally in jest, to knock them off the boat.

(They were perched up on the side rail of the boat, it would have been very easy.) They quieted down (possibly not wanting to get physical with a woman)called me a bitch and then sat down in seats.

Thinking back on this now, I did let them get to me and I bullyied back, AND it was satisfying to play a part in their change of behavior. I agree with Colleen that bullying is about making someone else feel bad so they can make themselves feel better.

-Heather

Dana Sheets · Post by **Dana Sheets** » Mon Apr 29, 2002 4:30 pm

I think there is also a difference between perceived bullying and actually bullying.

Have you ever felt bullied, then talked to the person about it, and then realized that no bullying was intended?

There was one woman in our dojo who thought that a male student was "bullying" her by always hitting hard, pushing her limits, making her uncomfortable. Then I asked her if she'd ever talked to the guy about it. "No."

Turns out he was just big and thought he was going easy and she was just small and hiding in her fear. But she wasn't comfortable saying something to him becuase she was afraid she'd appear "weak".

Pride goeth before...sometimes I think we bully ourselves.

When I was in 1st grade there was a girl, Polly, who much older and larger than anyone else in the class. She felt different and used her size and strength to bully everyone..to the point she was an outcast. Looking back now I can say she must have thought she'd be able to scare everyone into liking her - -but the opposite happened. Eventually we all ignored her and and ended up changing classes.

What does a bully do? They cross our boundries without our consent.
Dana

Dana Sheets · Post by **Dana Sheets** » Tue Apr 30, 2002 1:15 am

If you're looking for a missing post.
Please come join the discussion on the
"Women's Locker Room" thread.

thanks,
Dana

Cecil · Post by **Cecil** » Tue Apr 30, 2002 9:00 pm

"Because a girl being a bully is new, different, fascinating, and, IMHO, long overdue."

Overdue? What?

I must live on a different planet than most of you. I've seen cruelty come from both genders, in many different ways. Girls being new bullies: you must be kidding, right?

There is no excuse for it. It is cruelty, plain and simple. It is people hiding behind their superior size, greater verbal skills, position or ability to manipulate social courtesy. That is bullying and it is wrong, no matter who does it.

I guess given that logic, I should bully anyone who is a member of any group that has ever offended me, because it is overdue. Sounds wrong, doesn't it? That's because it is.