There was a debate above trying to determine if God exists. Who is God anyway?
On another note of spirituality vs the martial arts, I follow the belief, professed by many Chriatian Koreans that one can accept either Christ or the dragon into their soul, but not both. tiger and crane ok, But NOT the dragon; for to them he is the spirit of the devil.
Spirituality vs Religion
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jorvik
Allen
Quote
" Who is God anyway? ".........In my first post on this subject I asked the question........What is at the end of the Universe? It is sooo hard to concieve of infinity, something with no end. It requires a different thought process than we are equiped with. I imagine to concieve of God must be just as Difficult, maybe we need to change the way that we think?
BTW
Best of luck with the job search.
Quote
" Who is God anyway? ".........In my first post on this subject I asked the question........What is at the end of the Universe? It is sooo hard to concieve of infinity, something with no end. It requires a different thought process than we are equiped with. I imagine to concieve of God must be just as Difficult, maybe we need to change the way that we think?
BTW
Best of luck with the job search.
?
Hi,
So we are debating something we can't define?
I did ask for a definition in my first post.
Perhaps if we define what we mean by certain terms we would get further?
As to MA's being a spiritual path. I think i said on an earlier post MA's are Eastern Indiginous fighting arts. Originally anyway.
I'm not sure when the Spiritual element came into them.
Although I do use them in kind of theraputic way if that can be termed spiritual?
RK
So we are debating something we can't define?
I did ask for a definition in my first post.
Perhaps if we define what we mean by certain terms we would get further?
As to MA's being a spiritual path. I think i said on an earlier post MA's are Eastern Indiginous fighting arts. Originally anyway.
I'm not sure when the Spiritual element came into them.
Although I do use them in kind of theraputic way if that can be termed spiritual?
RK
Music is the space in between the notes
When I had my accident my spirit exited the broken lump deposited on the dirt and rocks and visited family members. I figure that's true because although there was no communication I was able to reveal to them what they were doing, the clothes they were wearing and a few other sundrious things. And there was more as well.
So I can say from that experience that I believe we are composed of a body as well as a detachable spirit. Whether there's a spirit or not, who really knows? However I tend to believe there's one.
I've taken a first step in defining the term spirit is as it relates to me.
I can take that one further as it relates to life, death, and the martial arts, but is it fair? I ask that question because that is how I perceive what a spirit is and have my own ways of trying to interact with it.
To me, a spirit is a well-defined "something" but to others it may not be.
Thanks, Jorvik, for the best wishes. That does heighten my spirits for the day.
So I can say from that experience that I believe we are composed of a body as well as a detachable spirit. Whether there's a spirit or not, who really knows? However I tend to believe there's one.
I've taken a first step in defining the term spirit is as it relates to me.
I can take that one further as it relates to life, death, and the martial arts, but is it fair? I ask that question because that is how I perceive what a spirit is and have my own ways of trying to interact with it.
To me, a spirit is a well-defined "something" but to others it may not be.
Thanks, Jorvik, for the best wishes. That does heighten my spirits for the day.
Always with an even keel.
-- Allen
-- Allen
Honest Deep Sea- I completely believe you, and the things I was playing with wouldn't come close to what you've experienced. It's extrodinaray and you'll get no arguement or ridicule from me! Too many times it has happened to people for me to say it didn't. I just wasn't sure if you knew what happened. 
I'm very grateful you're still here to tell about it though. did you "feel" while you were looking down? Not what was happening to your body persay- but anything else?
"out of body" is close to "astral projection" - astrtal projection can be played with (if one believes in such)- while meditating. What happened to you was the real deal near death- out of body- no questions asked- experience.
K
I'm very grateful you're still here to tell about it though. did you "feel" while you were looking down? Not what was happening to your body persay- but anything else?
"out of body" is close to "astral projection" - astrtal projection can be played with (if one believes in such)- while meditating. What happened to you was the real deal near death- out of body- no questions asked- experience.
K
First, what makes you think I was looking down? It seems to me that people think spirits are looking down on them. Why can't spirits just lay on their backs, say flat on a busy sidewalk in downtown Manhattan and look up??? It seems to me that spirits are transparently mobile and wouldn't be injured , maimed, or even noticed by passersby stomping all over them....did you "feel" while you were looking down...
If you were a spirit, K, where would you like to go and what would you like to do?
I felt free, free from the heap of confused bones lumped-up probably in the ditch by the side of the road where my 100 foot journey came to a halt ; free from the slippery red, raw, pulsating, exposed, paralyzed flesh not designed to bear witness to daylight; free from the cathether, the chest tube, the tubes down my throat, the intravenous piercings, the pain, anguish, torment, ... free from the unjoys of which I was unknowingly about to experience when the clouds of comatose would shortly whisk themselves away. Yes! I've had a taste of freedom -- and it's pretty good.did you "feel"
And yet slaven to life by the chains of a pact I made to return because as I looked down upon [yes, looking down is correct] my family, and saying to them in my own home without response nor acknowledgement, I could not leave them because they needed me too much, the request was granted. Maybe it was the will to live, and the next thing I knew I was awakening from a coma looking up [not down, this time], at the nurses and the doctors as the fog rapidly dissapated into clarity. I remember where my family was at the time, what they were wearing, and what they were doing as they verified, with their jaws hung slack, the details of my unannounced visit.
I was told of the horrors my wife experienced when she arrived in the hospital about 5-10 minutes after me [You’re LATE honey!]. There I was, in a stretcher ready to be taken somewhere, with my clothes cut off and laying in a deep pool of my own blood with it’s bright crimson hue rapidly advancing, taking over the starched whiteness upon which I rested. Motionless for a while and then all of a sudden, from head to toe, shaking violently in the redness, and then motionless again to be repeated several more times. And then quiet until I awoke from the coma three days later.
Oh, came out of the coma once just long enough to pull everything out – air tube down my throat, chest tube, iv’s, and ooohhh yes, get this: I pulled the catheter out, completely out. Wicked, real wicked!
Somehow I remember seeing the catheter as I pulled it out, [my face is turning white as I write this – right now -- and I need to lay down else I’m going to pass out] and that’s all; it must have been painful. I mean I’m going to pass out if I don’t stop typing and lay down on the floor.
That's it in a nutshell. There's more, lots more. However that's all I want to think about at this moment.
Last edited by Deep Sea on Tue Apr 15, 2003 9:18 pm, edited 6 times in total.
Always with an even keel.
-- Allen
-- Allen
I'm ok. I almost did pass out but made it to the horizontal in time. Had to lay down for only a few minutes. =Whwewh=, that was too close! I guess I'm not as tough as I thought I was, eh? Sometimes the past isn't too pleasant. Probably have a [broken] skeleton rattling around in my closet, no?
Besides, it's not everyday one can experience riding on the outside of a pickup truck -- and live to tell about it. BTW, I asked the officer how he knew I was carried/dragged 100 feet as reported in the newspaper. He replied "Oh, that was a no-brainer. I just took out the tape measure and measured 100 feet of blood."
Any more questions, K, I'll be glad to answer.
Besides, it's not everyday one can experience riding on the outside of a pickup truck -- and live to tell about it. BTW, I asked the officer how he knew I was carried/dragged 100 feet as reported in the newspaper. He replied "Oh, that was a no-brainer. I just took out the tape measure and measured 100 feet of blood."
Any more questions, K, I'll be glad to answer.
Always with an even keel.
-- Allen
-- Allen
BTW I was referring to when you said you were "looking down" on yourself- that's why I said what did it feel like to do so- Deep-
Ok- new question on this subject- where would you put- or catagorize- psychological "conditioning" or training- i.e. verbal sefl-defense, sticks n stones may break my bones but names can never hurt me - kind of thing- would you catagorize it as a "spiritual developement or would it infrindge somewhere on a person's religious beliefs to work in that area? Personally I would say that psychological kinds of "growth" are directly related to the spiritual aspect- when you learn how to protect yourself- it changes you- in a fundemental way. Yet- if a person is religious- would it affect their religious beliefs to allow that growth? See where I'm going with this?
What are every one's thoughts here?
K
Ok- new question on this subject- where would you put- or catagorize- psychological "conditioning" or training- i.e. verbal sefl-defense, sticks n stones may break my bones but names can never hurt me - kind of thing- would you catagorize it as a "spiritual developement or would it infrindge somewhere on a person's religious beliefs to work in that area? Personally I would say that psychological kinds of "growth" are directly related to the spiritual aspect- when you learn how to protect yourself- it changes you- in a fundemental way. Yet- if a person is religious- would it affect their religious beliefs to allow that growth? See where I'm going with this?
What are every one's thoughts here?
K
Hi
Hi,
Sorry been away due to health problems.
Can I ask if you think God is an exteranl reality or a subjective belief?
By the way have you heard that scientist reckon the belief in god is a component of our brains their to help us survive in evolutionary terms?
This is a recent discovery.
By the way i still think me saying God does not exist is no more inflamatory than people saying he does.
Science may prove catagorically one way or the other soon.
Humbly
RK
Sorry been away due to health problems.
Can I ask if you think God is an exteranl reality or a subjective belief?
By the way have you heard that scientist reckon the belief in god is a component of our brains their to help us survive in evolutionary terms?
This is a recent discovery.
By the way i still think me saying God does not exist is no more inflamatory than people saying he does.
Science may prove catagorically one way or the other soon.
Humbly
RK
Music is the space in between the notes
