Newbie with Questions

[jorvik]

The comments that I made are in respect to LE.........not all of them relate to Ma's, but to making her feel more confident and empowered, and also helping her to develop some feeling of control and peace in her mind.
Having said that ....that is a hell of a lot of ground to cover, I think people who post here regularly are familiar with the way I post and the kind of things I say, usually in my search for truth or even trying to be honest I tend to step on toes, or bring up things that most people don't want to hear,
Dana My take on weight training was that it would help LE be more confident with her body, it is also very good no matter what ma you study, and I think that we all agreed on Van's forum that pretty much anybody who was serious about ma's did some form of weight training, Bill is an advocate of it, so even medicos rate it
The comments by Ian were very relevant re self defence....not exactly what a person new to ma's wants to hear, but none the less what they should hear.......I like this site very much
http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/
I wasn't impressed with the hype at first.......but having put aside my predjudices against "self defence experts" I would say this guy is pretty much on the money.
The Bullet man stuff is good.....the reason that it is good is it takes you out of your "comfort zone"....however if you do it too much it could become a comfort zone........and it is a lot harder to do than most folks would think.
weapons are another thing.......I don't live in a gun culture, but I can still legally buy a shotgun, and that would be my weapon of choice, in the house at least, it has a tremendous deterrant value, even if you are useless with guns and never used one ( read me here ) you can still hit something, blow off a leg or whatever.
Also knives .......I love knives.
mt choice would be
http://store.knifecenter.com/pgi-Custom ... ,60,=,claw
a crkt bearclaw......nasty little knife.......a real cut and run thing, site an artey open it then run.....femoral would be best I think
What MA........Women are more likely to be raped/assaulted so maybe Judo,Brazilian Jiu jitsu.....some basic knowledge of strikes Uechi I dunno........Wing Chun is excellent ( if you get a could instructor, but p*ss poor if you don't) and it's also very philosophical, a nice art,as is Tai Chi.........if you can find a teacher worth his salt Maybe a little meditation to balance it out?....some Zen sitting Zazen, breath counting whatever.....Vipassana
But I'm a fella
What do the girls think, Dana, Kerry.....what would you advise LE to practise?......and why?........are womens requirements that much different to small weak mens?......what psychology would be different for a woman than a man? ....not many women doing Uechi ( and that's not a critisism, personnally I think it an excellent choice.......and Dana I think mixing it with the Mantis stuff is also excellent- A pretty profound insight)

[Dana Sheets]

" Is there a difference in the way women and men should learn martial arts for self-defense as a result of the different contexts in which the assaults are likely to occur for them?"

The contexts depend on your life. If you're a middle to upper middle class professional woman there is a probable set of situations for you to train.
If you're a poor woman who stays home with the kids there's another.
If you're single and dating and over 21 there's another set.
If you're single and dating and under 21 still another.

You're not just training physical responses, you're training your mindset and rehearsing verbal options for various scenarios. For example, if I'm 16 and at a high school dance and a guy asks me to go get it on with him in his car I need options for that. If I'm 45 and at the office holiday party and my boss' boss tells me to give him a BJ in the copy room or I lose my job, I need another set of options. (And I should also know by legal rights) If my husband/partner tells me we're having sex that night and I don't want to I need another set of options. If I'm any of the above people and I'm a victim of the less than 1% chance of random violence I need still more options.

The hard part is that there's no real curriculum to follow. Most of the ancient masters weren't women and most of them didn't build complex systems that include verbal and emotional self-defense. Most "systems" are simply physical fighting principles. Some of them come with cracker-barrel philosophy, but none come with solid methods to build verbal skills, tactical ways to assess different types of agressors and situations, or information on your modern legal rights on a state by state basis.

And I haven't yet found a place that teaches this stuff on a regular basis with enough socializing and fun to keep me coming back for more. This is the allure of the traidtional dojo. You make friends, work hard, learn cool (if sometimes useless) stuff. Self-defense classes that dig into the ugly stuff are emotionally draining, not that much fun, and everyone's so uncomfortable most of the time you're not focused on making friends. You're focused on absorbing as much as possible and worrying who's going to be the next to have an emotional meltdown (and if that's going to be you).

So, like most "what's the best" questions, I think the student and the teacher matter much more than the system. Judo, Uechi, WC, Mantis, heck, even Tae Kwon Do -- if the teacher is willing to mix in good solid advice and scenario training based around self-defense and has a dedicated interest in building awareness in the female students....that's the right place to be.

Again, this is all just my opinion - so I'd love to hear what other women think. I'm just pretty sure I'm not going to find what I need in once place. There is no "supermarket" for self-defense. It's more like the old days of les ateliers...you have to go from specialty shop to specialty shop to buy all the ingredients you need for dinner.

Dana

[jorvik]

Hi Dana,
I agree with you, but you have highlighted problems that relate to all of us, you don't have to be female to face discrimination, or black, for that matter. What you find in my culture ,at least, is that you can be discriminated against for all sorts of non descript reasons. I have been discriminated against for being disabled....though possibly that would be the wrong word for it.
I remmeber work colleagues going out jogging, and asking me if I would like to come along ( one of them was my Boss). At the time I could not get around without the use of a stick my arthritis was so bad, I later had to have a hip replacement. I'm not saying that other people don't get similar treatment, But it really gets to you when you are in physical pain all the time, can't sleep at night because of it....are worried sick about taking too much medication( which you know is bad for you), case you're not around for your kids..and some A*hole makes a comment like that. I think that one of the problems we face is that people who really need to be heard ...rarely are

[regkray]

Hi Le,


I live in the UK, so my references are slightly diferent.

You could visit this site it is by a wonderful man/Martial Artist.
He has had over 300 fights won them all.

Very tough but very nice.

There is so much information on his site.

www.geoffthompson.com

there are links from this site to other good sites.

I'm sure you'll find it helpful.


Take Care

RK

[regkray]

Don't mention it.


RK

[2Green]

Wow...New Age lives in Britain as well! Bouncer-turned self-help Guru.
Over here we have George Foreman: boxer-turned infomercial grille-salesman--and very successful too. More than boxing ever was for him.

Something in the tone of these types of slick-publishing/promo presentations somehow puts me off. It seems too over-the-top, and maybe it's the publishers' faults for 'slicking up' the basic core of truth, but it gives the whole thing a patina of hucksterism. I think a lot of sincere people with a real story to tell, or something genuine to offer, get caught up in the mass market and wind up being perceived as "just like all the rest".
Maybe it's just me, but it looks like "it's all about Geoff Thompson".
BTW, never heard of him prior to this.

NM

[Guest]

Neil, Geoff Thompson is the real deal and well respected I'm surprised You've not heard of him. If you do a search on this site you will find his name come up a lot.

Van has recomended his work on more than one ocassion, and Darren Laur just recomended his forum the other day.
Might be worth a 2nd look.

Laird

[2Green]

I browsed the URL given;that's what I saw there: I'll try a more in-depth search, & reserve judgment!

Thanks!

NM

[Deep Sea]

Hey Dana.

and at the office holiday party and my boss' boss tells me to give him a BJ in the copy room or I lose my job,

As you strongly decline [if that's your intention] reach into your pocketbook and somehow your high-capacity handgun permit accidentally falls onto the floor -- even flash him a purposeful glimpse of the shiny metal of your new stainless snub-nose .38 to deliver a strong quiet signal that you are not his sex toy. Liberally use your [female] tools to request/ coerce/ influence/ sweet-talk that he pick it up knowing his eyes will scan it and you may need no further words to seperate yourself from an otherwise sticky situation.

In terms of husbandly advances, remember that WIFE is only an acronym that most loving husbands religiously adhere to as their formal creed . Remember, too, that the gentleness-level of your crane block can be used as a personal gauge of applied rejection to your hubby even as signals intended toward encouraging him to perform male-degrading non-sexual acts such as doing the wash, ironing, dishes, etcetera.

[Le Haggard]

Hey everyone,

Great follow-ups. Thanks.

DANA: I do agree that women need different MA self-defense methods. That's why I asked.

Deep Sea: With all due respect, I don't like guns. That's why I'm studying Martial Arts and what the original question Dana was responding to is about. Additionally, where I've worked they aren't allowed with or without permits..weapons there are infact prohibited by law regardless of licensing, i.e. government nuclear sites and state schools. Also, as a survivor of 8 years of domestic violence, I can tell you the husband situations don't work that way either. Hopefully your comments were a joke.

Thanks all for the martial arts info! I appreciate it.

Le'

[Deep Sea]

Hopefully your comments were a joke.

As usual, with my wry dryness, they were and they were not at the same time. My statements were also NOT to be taken in a demeaning manner toward women in any way, shape, of form -- I LOVE women. Whenever I get involved, even lightly as I did above, my purpose is more often than not to deliver an important message or at minimum for others to dwell upon what I wrote.

1) I don't care for guns either because in my 20s/30s I've exprienced a little of what handguns are meant for. 'nuff said.

On the "infact prohibited by law regardless of licensing, i.e. government nuclear sites," A few weeks ago I completed a 2-year contract designing and implementing my piece of software for the world's most sophisticated radar [when it's done]. I was locked up every day in a secure area hidden in the deepest part of a large building, and checked daily by the guards, so I know the rules too.

2) I've managed to escape from overzelous females in the workplace on a number of occasions. Their unwelcomed approaches, while not outwardly violent, can produce deadly results. Although women have been known to hack people up, shoot them, etc., their tools are often much more subtle and succinct -- woe to the man who falls into the trap [I sometimes think that the word wo'man may be a contraction].

On the night I kicked my ex out, she tried to beat me up. What a joke.

3) I know first hand about domestic violence. Ho boy, do I!!! I grew up in the middle of it for 14 years, so you're not alone there either. My dad returned from WW-II with some serious problems that were directly related to his combat experience as he fought his way into Berlin from a beach in Italy [Never knew the name of it, sorry]. His problems manifested themselves uncontrollably as well as too frequently. I long ago forgave him during his last week of life to rest his soul [and mine too].

He was a mild-mannered person, but when he drank he would beat mom up. When he finished with her, if I was around, he'd let into me with a guerrison belt so violently I could not sit down or lay on my back for days at the time. I can remember that strap all the way back to when I was about 4 years old, getting it in the daytime when my mom was not around when he was on a bender.

I also remember one night when I was 14. I fell asleep on the couch in the living room with my shoes on and that got him started. When I heard him go back into the kitchen and remove that heavy leather strap from his work pants I got up and waitied for him in the middle of the room. In his first swing, I grabbed the belt, hung on to it for dear life, and stopped him dead in his tracks. Now, I'm a nonviolent person -- absolutely hate it even when a woman screams on TV -- but I told him what I was going to do to him if he ever laid a hand on either mom or me again because I'm getting bigger and stronger and if I couldn't take him tonight it wouldn't be long before I would be able to put him down.

He never laid a hand on mom and I again. Fact, he moved out of the house shortly after that. AND was able to master most of his drinking problem from then until the end of his time.

When I was thirteen or fourteen, dad made a physical advance of a sensitive nature -- and he failed. Drunk people don't know what they are doing. I had a strong mind and I already knew where my dick belonged. Besides I knew his mental and physical weaknesses and was easily able to give him the slip. That little "cornering" couldn't have been in his nature because he never tried again.

Like I say I forgave him because he had no control, his mind was just gone. But it was still a long rough road in hell.

So I understand just a little of your 8 years of hell and can empathize because he liked to use his fists on mom and left some wicked bruises sometimes. It's something that either makes you stong or it kills you inside. If you survive, you put it behind you and go forward from there. If it kills you inside then you are whatever is left of you.

[Le Haggard]

Deep Sea/Allen,

Thanks. I figured as much. As for the DV, I can honestly say you likely have more "experience" than I do likely in some parts of it. I wasn't counting the regular thrashings I got from my older brother or other incidents of violence in my life though.

As you obviously know, the abusers in DV don't attack when you have weapons handy. If they did, they wouldn't be the cowards that they are. Mine is mainly from my ex who couldn't deal with the fact that #1 I'm more intelligent than he is, #2 I made more money than he did, #3 I had more family support than he did, #4+ Insert whatever other reason he could come up with at the time. Unlike your father, my ex and brother both were cold sober ... It would have been so much easier dealing with them if they had been drunk.

I think the worst of it all is the mental part though. I don't know that anyone really survives it and just leaves it behind. I know my worst scars are inside and there will always be traces. I'm in MAs, for example, to stop flinching when men make any sudden move around me... Men in general make me nervous. Sometimes, the biggest accomplishment is just surviving at all.

Le'

P.S.: Where I worked "on-site" I had to go past multiple gates of guys with Uzies (however that is spelled) at multiple points just to get to my work station for 10 years.

[Deep Sea]

I wasn't counting the regular thrashings I got from my older brother or other incidents of violence in my life though.

I’ve never hit a woman in my entire life except in the dojo where you are supposed to hit people. I understand it’s either or both a male insecurity and a need to dominate/control that causes men to bully women. Stupid because love and kindness works far better with lasting results.

Siblings! Mine two younger sons wore me out sometimes. I remember hundreds of times coming in between them as the older of the pair was always coming down on the younger one. I’ve come home from work as late as January of this year to head-off what could have conceivably been a violent confrontation between the two of them. As it was I dodged a flying opened can of diet pepsi in the living room delivered via air express from the younger to the older resoundlu smacking him square in the middle of the chest. And they dearly love each other. Right!

As you obviously know, the abusers in DV don't attack when you have weapons handy.

I don’t quite know that. My dad, definitely not a coward, on a few occasions waived a loaded German Lugar at mom during his threats. Not too often but all it takes is one slip of trigger finger. One day mom had the balls to get rid of it. Shame we couldn’t have hidden it because that handgun was a real trophy, Dad removed it from the holster of a Nazi soldier he bayoneted to death during the heat of some nasty fighting.

#1 I'm more intelligent than he is, #2 I made more money than he did, #3 I had more family support than he did,

What a desirous treasure you are [really!]. Your hubby REALLY screwed up!!!

Unlike your father, my ex and brother both were cold sober ... It would have been so much easier dealing with them if they had been drunk.

I don’t know if that’s always valid, whether or not a sober/drunk is easier to deal with. When someone goes on a rampage it might not matter. I really don’t know.

I think the worst of it all is the mental part though. I don't know that anyone really survives it and just leaves it behind. I know my worst scars are inside and there will always be traces.

The mental part is tough, it really is sometimes. I can only speak for myself and for others whom I know have traced similar paths. I had a hard time dealing with self and others for a while in high school, but I never knew why I was the way I was until many years later. I know I survived and left it behind, but it was only when I was in my 20s or 30s after I found out I was a little on the wild side and went searching to find out why. When I wrote my previous riposte above I brushed and poked at ugly scars imbedded in my heart, but failed to open wounds because time healed those wounds which are no longer.

The bottom line is that in order to go forward one must pick oneself up and brush oneself off each time one falls. That’s a lot easier said than done and when one is going through it, it can be difficult to get out the duster, especially when it gets to you and you don’t want to go on anymore. Easy answers are far and few between nor are there many easy solutions. But life goes on and somewhere along the line one has to decide whether or not he/she wants to carry unwanted baggage around.

There are other traumatic incidents that can happen in a person's life that leave permanent memorable damage, Le, but you have to control it rather than it controlling you.

I wish the best for you, Le Haggard, because you deserve the best.

I'm in MAs, for example, to stop flinching when men make any sudden move around me... Men in general make me nervous. Sometimes, the biggest accomplishment is just surviving at all.

Remember that most of us are really good guys and that it’s only a few who spoil it for everyone else. Find someone you know and can trust and start from there.

[Le Haggard]

Thanks Allen

I've got a long way to go and get the joy of dealing with two teens/preteens right now myself. I've walked into many a flying object with my two...the oldest is a girl so it's not just the males. Such is life. I'm just trying to change several generations of family DV history on their father's side for them...That is perhaps the toughest part.

I "know" consciously that all guys aren't bad...just like I know that all swans aren't white. I just have never personally seen a black swan or been in that close of a relationship with a guy that wasn't.

I do want to clarify, because apparently from your response I wasn't clear. I said "As you obviously know, the abusers in DV don't attack when you have weapons handy." I mean my ex or brother never came after me when I had a weapon handy. I've never actually heard of a domestic violence situation where the abuser went after someone who could defend themself with a weapon at that instance. Again, maybe that is the "black swan" and I just haven't seen or heard about it.

As for the rest, thanks for the compliments and good wishes. Supportive men like you are actually why I got into MAs.

Good luck with your kids, too!

LeAnn

[regkray]

Hi,

Wow did you get this wrong.

Geoff is a lovely guy, yes I've met him.

He is genuinely spiritual and genuinely hard.

I think of him as the ideal Martial Artist in a way. He went through the flames and came through the other end a better person. Isn't that what we're all after?

Wow...New Age lives in Britain as well! Bouncer-turned self-help Guru.
Over here we have George Foreman: boxer-turned infomercial grille-salesman--and very successful too. More than boxing ever was for him.

George Foreman was the world heavyweight boxing champion and a good one, not successful???

Something in the tone of these types of slick-publishing/promo presentations somehow puts me off. It seems too over-the-top,

There's nothing over the top in Geoff everything on that page is true.

and maybe it's the publishers' faults for 'slicking up' the basic core of truth, but it gives the whole thing a patina of hucksterism. I think a lot of sincere people with a real story to tell, or something genuine to offer, get caught up in the mass market and wind up being perceived as "just like all the rest".
Maybe it's just me,


no offence but it is just you.

but it looks like "it's all about Geoff Thompson".
BTW, never heard of him prior to this.

Well if you ain't heard of Geoff you're missing a lot and don't know much about real world Martial Arts.

Take a nother look on his page be open minded I'm sure you'll agree with me.

Take care



RK



NM