Anyone heard of HGH as a dietary supplement

Panther · Post by **Panther** » Sat May 24, 2003 7:09 pm

And does this stuff work?

I always have serious doubts about such claims. So, I thought I'd ask the medical professionals if this stuff is what it's cracked up to be.

http://www.goldhgh.com

Stryke · Post by **Stryke** » Sat May 24, 2003 9:58 pm

Hey Panther I`m no medical expert , but what ive read it sure does , all the information I`ve read has been bodybuilding/powerlifting sights though , Id think small doses for the older folks would significantly improve lifestyle , but your dabbling with the whole steroid thing really arent ya , Im sure there probably talking small doses . This is under the care of a medical proffessional type stuff , is there a way to messure the amount of growth hormone you currently have/should have , wouldnt most people get the same benifits from a little jab of testosterone ? .

I know that big amounts run the risk of the internal organs etc enlarging , theres got to be drawbacks , this stuff to me is getting into serious bio-chemistry , its no multivitamin as far as I`m concerned , I`m quite interested in what the experts around here have to say , no real help here , but a few more questions

Is this stuff there marketing HGH or a clever way of earning money of the rep ? , I just looked at the ingredients page ? , this looks like a carefully designed scam to me , cites all the benifits on Hormone therapy then claims no actuall hormones in the product ....

Stryke

Josann · Post by **Josann** » Sat May 24, 2003 11:54 pm

You may be referring to hgh stimulators rather than pure human growth hormone. The stimulators are precursers to the growth hormone, that is they allow the body to produce more hgh than they normally would. The supplements are often difficult to take as they need to be taken sublingually at various times during the day. They make some pretty outrageous claims for their effectiveness. Pure, real human growth hormone is extracted from the pituitary glands of human cadavers and is very expensive( even more so than the precursers, which are pretty costly themselves). Not sure as to their effectiveness as I tried them once, but do to work I was unable to keep to the rigid schedule needed to take them. I'd be interested to hear from someone that gave them a trial.

IJ · Post by IJ » Tue May 27, 2003 10:53 am

The new human growth hormone is recombinant, that is, lab made. Giving people dead brain extract was too expensive and too risky for transmitting diseases from viruses to prion (mad cow). It still ain't cheap.

Bill Glasheen · Post by **Bill Glasheen** » Tue May 27, 2003 5:07 pm

You folks are on this subject pretty well. I've kept an eye on the hoopla for a while.

First, this is a direct quote from their webpage.

Now there are natural substances (secretagogues) which have been documented to increase growth hormone naturally...

Calling this stuff "hgh" anything is misleading, to say the very least. It is not human growth hormone. It allegedly stimulates the production of hGH. There is no literature substantiating that this product works, nor does it show that the effect is "physiologically significant" even if "statistically significant."

Buyer beware on all these products. I don't even begin to look at them unless 1) they come from a very small handful of reputable companies and/or 2) there was research done on that specific product that substantiates the medical effects. NOT research done on hGH injections, so that their hGH secretaguge obviously delivers the same effect. This is two generations removed from efficacy.

Now to the side effects... Some have been mentioned.

Acromegaly, by the way, is a known side effect of congenital overproduction of hGH - usually due to a pituitary gland tumor. You get the "Andre the Giant" look.

Sadly, a number of female body builders have destroyed their facial features by doing hGH injections. You get a female with a Tank McNamara / Jay Leno jaw. A good eye can pick out the hGH abusers in all the bodybuilding mags - in either sex.

The symptoms of acromegaly are a great place to look for what to expect with hGH therapy.

Diagnosis and Treatment of Acromegaly.
Author/s: Anne D. Walling
Issue: July, 1999

(Great Britain-The Practitioner, February 1999, p. 110) In a population of 1 million, 60 to 70 adults have acromegaly, and about three new cases are detected each year. The diagnosis of this rare disease may be delayed because the symptoms develop slowly over several years, but recognition is important because of the association between acromegaly and diabetes and cardiovascular, cerebrovascular and respiratory complications. The cause is usually a benign pituitary tumor, but any source of excessive growth hormone can lead to acromegaly. The characteristic changes in appearance are related to enlargement of the jaw, hands, feet and facial bones and separation of the teeth. Thickening of the skin and soft tissues also contributes to enlargement of the nose, lips, hands and tongue. Patients have excessive sweating, acne, musculoskeletal pain and weakness, as well as neurologic symptoms related to the growing intracranial tumor. Hypertension and diabetes each occurs in about one third of cases. Treatment options include surgery and radiotherapy to destroy the endocrine-producing tumor or medical therapy based on analogs of somatostatin. Patients with acromegaly require lifelong therapy and monitoring for complications.

COPYRIGHT 1999 American Academy of Family Physicians

Sound implausible for someone receiving low-dose therapy? Check out this one (of very many) publications on the subject.

J Clin Endocrinol Metab 2003 Apr;88(4):1455-63

Growth hormone replacement therapy induces insulin resistance by activating the glucose-fatty acid cycle.

Bramnert M, Segerlantz M, Laurila E, Daugaard JR, Manhem P, Groop L.

Department of Endocrinology, University Hospital, S-205 02 Malmo, Sweden. margareta.bramnert@skane.se

The effects of GH replacement therapy on energy metabolism are still uncertain, and long-term benefits of increased muscle mass are thought to outweigh short-term negative metabolic effects. This study was designed to address this issue by examining both short-term (1 wk) and long-term (6 months) effects of a low-dose (9.6 micro g/kg body weight.d) GH replacement therapy or placebo on whole-body glucose and lipid metabolism (oral glucose tolerance test and euglycemic hyperinsulinemic clamp combined with indirect calorimetry and infusion of 3-[(3)H]glucose) and on muscle composition and muscle enzymes/metabolites, as determined from biopsies obtained at the end of the clamp in 19 GH-deficient adult subjects. GH therapy resulted in impaired insulin-stimulated glucose uptake at 1 wk (-52%; P = 0.008) and 6 months (-39%; P = 0.008), which correlated with deterioration of glucose tolerance (r = -0.481; P = 0.003). The decrease in glucose uptake was associated with an increase in lipid oxidation at 1 wk (60%; P = 0.008) and 6 months (60%; P = 0.008) and a concomitant decrease in glucose oxidation. The deterioration of glucose metabolism during GH therapy also correlated with the enhanced rate of lipid oxidation (r = -0.508; P = 0.0002). In addition, there was a shift toward more glycolytic type II fibers during GH therapy. In conclusion, replacement therapy with a low-dose GH in GH-deficient adult subjects is associated with a sustained deterioration of glucose metabolism as a consequence of the lipolytic effect of GH, resulting in enhanced oxidation of lipid substrates. Also, a shift toward more insulin-resistant type II X fibers is seen in muscle. Glucose metabolism should be carefully monitored during long-term GH replacement therapy.

All the wonderful hoopla of early hGH therapy hasn't panned out. The Hollywood testimonials are no substitute for good science. Make no mistake about it - there are side effects. Insulin insensitivity (Type II diabetes) is the earliest and most common.

The FDA has approved the use of hGH injections in children for dwarfism and in adults for clinically low levels of hGH. But NOT for vanity, bodybuilding, "fountain of youth", etc. There is some experimental work being done for patients with diseases that have symptoms worse than the side effects of hGH therapy (AIDs, etc.).

The best/cheapest/easiest way to stimulate levels of hGH are:

1) INTENSE exercise (not aerobics...),

2) a balanced diet, and

3) good quality sleep on a regular sleep cycle.

There are other products out there in the health and bodybuilding arena that give you many orders of magnitude more value.

- Bill

Drona · Post by **Drona** » Tue May 27, 2003 10:44 pm

Dear Bill Thank You for what you just posted.
In the end, it is not the strength of the body but the strength of the mind over it that counts. There lies the real beauty and power, the rest is an illusion.

Chris McCracken · Post by **Chris McCracken** » Wed May 28, 2003 3:40 am

Hi all,

Again, I am a bit late in, but this product is simply a series of free-form amino acids purported to increase growth hormone secretion. Anyone who was into strength training ten years ago will remember the L-Arginine and L-Ornithine "breakthroughs", which turned out, actually, to be rorts.

These supplements did, indeed, increase GH release, but only when administered IV in quantities that made purchase even more expensive than real HGH.

This is a similar product. It includes Arginine and Ornithine, as well as Gamma Amino Butyric Acid (GABA - A GH "releaser" commonly advertised in "Musclemag" during the mid nineties).

It also conttains Taurine, which is presumably added to improve the "uptake" of the nutrients. Tyrosine and the BCAAs are added, as well. They are well proven in improvement of mental alertness and recovery, but not for GH release, as far as I could make out.

There are some other, less pertinent ingredients, as well.

As Bill has said, these products are unproven and have dubious value, even if the claims were true.

Recently, a couple of clients remarked about a supplement they'd seen with "HGH Added". The product obviously didn't have any added HGH. First, it would be illegal, second, ridiculously expensive (which it was, I suppose) and third - And perhaps most importantly - HGH can't be absorbed orally.

I hope this post is helpful.

Chris McCracken

Bill Glasheen · Post by **Bill Glasheen** » Wed May 28, 2003 1:24 pm

Right on the money, Chris!

Oh but how we wish these things worked as advertised. Thankfully you can now go in most healthfood stores (like GNC), and they actually have computer kiosks where you can query about the efficacy/effectiveness of these various nutritive elements. As much a stake as GNC has in selling stuff like this, the evidence presented for physiologically significant stimulation of hGH is weak at best.

There are a handful of things you can get some value from if you have dollars to spend in these stores. This just isn't one of them.

- Bill

IJ · Post by IJ » Wed May 28, 2003 9:59 pm

General guideline: there aren't going to be many miracle products out there that's better or cheaper than healthy living. If more of XXXX was good for you, in the absence of some medical problem, your body would just make it. God, or millions of years of evolution (depending on viewpoint) can't be wrong, right?

Bill Glasheen · Post by **Bill Glasheen** » Wed May 28, 2003 10:57 pm

Two important concepts here:

1) God (or millions of years of evolution) intended it that way. We keep trying to thwart mother nature, only to be shown why it's not nice to do so. Check out the below article in today's press.

Hormone therapy linked to dementia

Give a woman more female hormones (estrogen, progestin) than the cycle of life gives her, and there may be problems. Give a male more hormones (testosterone) than the cycle of life gives him, and there can be problems (more hair loss, earlier enlarged prostate problems, higher risk of prostate cancer, higher risk of heart attack, etc., etc.). Same with growth hormone.

2) Homeostasis is the body's attempt to maintain a balance for "optimal" function. When the level of one control system stimulus goes up, the body will respond - often to put that level in check. Force it and the body stays in constant combat with you.

Ever wonder why professional male bodybuilders don't take showers in public? It's because homeostasis (the body's response to all those anabolic steroids) causes their walnuts to turn into little peas.

Ironic, ain't it?

- Bill

P.S. Consult your physician on all health matters. Each individual's needs are unique