What Color Gi?

[2Green]

The Gi honours the tradition; I have no problem with that. But it's a suit.
You are NEVER going to get in a fight wearing one unless:
A: You are in a tournament.
or,
B: You decided to wear your Gi to class and the local punk contingent at the 7/11 where you stopped to pick up a Dasani decides to give you a "pre-class" Karate test.

So, it's a suit. A badly-designed training suit based on tradition, which we in our "modern day training wisdom" put up with, despite its incredibly hot and restrictive shortcomings. It serves a purpose like any uniform.
I think it should be used in testing and formal functions. I feel strongly that it should NEVER be worn in civilian company; i.e. on the way to, or returning from the Dojo. If I were a teacher I would forbid this of my students.

Anyway, Gi-pants, belt and white tank-top is my preferred dress for the summer months. Brought in a gym bag to the Dojo, changed into and out of just for class.
I also advocate bringing a bottle of water and a face towel, and perhaps some Dr. Scholls' foot powder.

NM

[Dana Sheets]

Most Uechi schools I visit require all white all the time.

Is this a trend of the past fading away or a standard for now and the future?

[Bill Glasheen]

I think this depends, Dana. Different schools emphasize different things.

When I first studied, my teacher (Rad Smith) wore only a gi bottom. Memorial Gym at U.Va. had no air conditioning (at the time) and was dirty as heck (still is...). Once the environment got a little less hot and dirty, I asked that all wear some kind of gi.

It's worth mentioning that a gi top provides some very practical training advantages that you "strikers only" folks aren't considering. Upper body clothing can and will be used against you in a fight. Wear a tank top to my workout and expect me to grab on to it. Don't complain if I tear it to shreds. If you have nothing on your arms, don't complain if I grab into your arm flesh after wauke and maybe even extract some arm hair. Too bad if you get scratched or abraded, and later get a staff infection.

Good gi tops - especially either grappling or self defense types - can take a licking and keep on ticking. So one could reasonably argue that wearing something that you don't want used against you in the class is less reasonable than wearing the white pajamas.

A gi was built the way it is to allow a person to move freely, and have clothing as part of the fighting "environment." All things considered, it's not a bad "uniform" from a practical point of view.

It would be interesting however to wear T-shirts in class that you don't mind getting shredded. There are some things you can do with a T-shirt (like pull it over your partner's head) that just can't be done with a traditional gi.

And speaking of "reality-based" training, has anyone ever thought about what a BG could do to you when wearing a formal tie?

- Bill

[Bill Glasheen]

Funny I should write what I did. Tonight I had to slip into the dojo late and teach with my work clothes on. Mostly I can, where I just walk through stuff. Tonight however I had folks grabbing my shirt to make a point. And woudn't you know that my student grabbed my shirt and ripped a piece right off the front of it. Now that's what I'm talking about!

***** about the shirt though...

- Bill

[2Green]

"and later get a staff infection. "

..isn't that "STAPH" infection?

If I were visiting another Dojo I would always wear "full whites" out of respect.
Mr. Glasheen is correct that many Uechi techniques require grabbing the Gi.

And, for the record, we have always trained in full whites; the tank top thing was my "druthers".

NM

[2Green]

"A gi was built the way it is to allow a person to move freely"

On the planet I live on (Earth), a Gi is a CEREMONIAL COSTUME which is INCREDIBLY hot, restrictive, and in no way bears any resemblance to a workout-related outfit.
At home I do my Uechi workouts in a pair of flannel "jammy-pants" and a tank. Very comfortable and loose. Early pictures of Okinawan "Gi's" look like loincloths or diapers, so I don't buy the "Gi-was-designed-for-workouts idea. Those early Karateka were hot and sweaty and wore as little as they had to.
Oh, but they don't have the crisp snap, do they?!

NM

[GSantaniello]

After having obtained dan rank in the dojo that i had studied in, we were allowed to wear black gi's as an optional choice. It was a "privialge" of choice after having acomplished dan ranks.

However, all others were only to wear white gi's. Also, for any dan rank promotional, demo's or such, we did wear a nice clean presentable white Gi, staying in the "traditional" format.

I liked the "option" then and i like it now. However, many dojo's that i have visited (Uechi-ryu) do not allow black at all.

In the hot summer months, i allow "T' shirts and wear one myself. Also at the "Hut" many of us wear them also. A dojo that i often visit believes only in white gi's no "T' shirts. I believe that the reason for some is that in "Okinawa" they wear gi's and that it is "traditional".

It is true as another indicated that one cannot "grab" without a gi on. However, the person you are confronted with on the street in the summer won't have one on either.

[2Green]

Gary S.:
Do you know where the "Black Gi" tradition originally started?
Just wondering.

NM

[Bill Glasheen]

Sorry about the spelling problem with staphylococcus aureus (aka staph). Must have been a Freudian slip (staff in the dojo) or something.

- Bill

[GSantaniello]

2Green, (NM)

I do not know as to the Black Gi being that of "traditional". Only that outside of my Uechi circle, i have seen many other schools and several other styles wearing them.

Black Gi's may not have any simular traditional value to other styles as white gi's do to uechiryu.

However, i once saw a picture of master Kanbum Uechi in all black that hung upon the dojo wall next to a picture of Kanei who was not in black.

It did resemble somewhat of dress attire more than a workout gi. Somewhat of a unique looking uniform.

[f.Channell]

Personally I don't care about the gi thing at all. Lately I've found the obi is restricting my stretch and have been taking it off for junbi undo. I left it off at camp.
I don't mind what my students wear as long as they want to learn and train hard. A formal ocasion like a test I have them wear it.
The gi could be looked at as a rip off of Judo and jujitsu (gi envy) since they wore them in judo decades before Karate adopted them. Although they are heavier for pulling on.
It could have been what Karate had to do in order to be accepted in mainland Japan.
Judo now allows the use of unbleached, bleached, or blue gi by any rank.
This is to see the difference during contest and award points.
Many in Judo feel as some here that it should only be white.
I wonder about Kung Fu and other arts.
F.

[SAN-DAI-RYU]

WHITE
ALL WHITE

[Dana Sheets]

A little history on ranks in karate...

http://www.judoinfo.com/karateranks.htm

Actually, Funakoshi was greatly influenced by Jigoro Kano, aristocratic founder of judo, and originator of the dan/kyu system. Kano was a highly respected individual, and Funakoshi prided himself on being an educated and "proper" man who rightly believed that he was acting correctly. Kano's system was not only being applied to judo, but to other budo as well under the aegis of the Butoku-kai and the Japanese Ministry of Education. Funakoshi, then, just adopted the order of the day: a ranking system officially sanctioned by Japan's greatest martial arts entities. Funakoshi's own rank was of no consequence, since it seems that belt ranking was really just something for the students, not for headmasters.

For its part, the Butoku-kai issued instructor's licenses: the titles renshi (the lowest), kyoshi, and hanshi (the highest). It would be a while before the dan/kyu system became universal in karate. By the end of the 1930s, each karate group was called upon to register with the butoku-kai for official sanctioning, and in 1938, a meeting of the Butoku-kai's official karatedo leaders was held in Tokyo. Its purpose was to discuss the standards for awarding rank within their art. Attending, among others, were Hironori Ohtsuka of wado-ryu, Kenwa Mabuni of shito-ryu, Kensei Kinjo (Kaneshiro) and Sannosuke Ueshima of kushin-ryu, Tatsuo Yamada of Nippon kempo, Koyu Konishi of shindo-jinen-ryu, and a young Gogen Yamaguchi of goju-ryu. Most of these men were founders of their own styles, and as such automatically became the highest rank that their agreed-on respective standards allowed. Yamaguchi assumed leadership of goju-ryu because, we are told, goju-ryu's founder, Chojun Miyagi, personally asked him to take the leadership of the style in Japan. About then, Funakoshi also finalized the grading standards for use at his shotokan dojo.

It would seem that the standard uniform evolved at the same time people came up with a system for ranks.

I would guess that white was used because white fabric is cheaper than fabric dyed another color.

[Stryke]

I actually beleive it was white because that was the common colour for japanese under garments of the time .

and Ive heard possibly another reason was the abundance of American white canvas at a certain time in history .

but Ive also heard the myths of purity and so such , and It showed the lack of blood being a peacefull way .

I just dont personally think 50 years is a tradition , but i like Gi`s to train in , although I`m going to a heavier grappling Gi cause I`m sick of Laird ripping them .

I`m positive Funakoshi took the rank system from Kano , they from what Ive heard (more hearsay ala MA ) that they had quite a positive relationship and personally I see them as pure complementary styles along one paradigm .

[f.Channell]

Good post Dana.
We actually have a 6 Kyu system in Judo and 12 Dan ranks.
No one has been awarded 10th dan since the 1950's I don't believe.
I've read that Kano got the ranking idea from western swimming contests.
As they moved up they got a different color or something.

Stryke,
I believe Bill Glasheen has a grappling/Karate gi he likes. You might give that one a try. I think it's a Kwon?
Watch out for cheap Judo gi's they shrink. I use a HSU it doesn't shrink and it's not much more money.

Fred