Great question, Shoken-sama!
IME (over the past 30 or so years), the ranks in a specific dojo are usually pretty well defined as to skill levels. Once outside that specific dojo, however, there seems to be some pretty wide variation in some styles (Uechi does NOT seem to be one of those styles, BTW!).
Belts (as my Sensei put it) were developed to denote competency. In my style there was (originally as he was taught) White, Green Brown and Black.
Stripes and other colors came much later to cater to the American attitude of wanting something for showing achievement in the short haul and as a reward to students who not only showed prowess and proficiency, but as an award for being there over a longer period (and THAT'S one of the "secrets" of belts - according to him).
A belt is an indicator that someone has taken the time, energy, effort and pain to be able to do certain things in a certain way and to a set of somewhat mutable standards, depending on the review boards. It is also an indicator of UNDERSTANDING of their art, IMO. Or should be.
In some ways, a Belt review committee is similar to the judging panels in competitive ice skating. They judge a performance on certain required moves, set forms (like in old style judging in figure skating where they would literally use a micrometer to measure how perfectly someone had skated over their figure 8) and on style, power accuracy and the like. But- they also work like boxing judges during the fighting portion of an exam and as academic judges on the written portions (should there be any). At least that's my experience of them.
One of the things I appreciate about this forum is that there IS a stress on the academic and intellectual aspects of the art. Some dojo/dojang/kwoon I have visited over the years seem to have one attitude - get in the ring and kick some a$$ - nothing more.
Personally, I think that there's lots more to a MA than that and the award of a belt should reflect that as much as the ability to do good kata or kumite.
Respectfully,
Lee Darrow, C.Ht. (Sandan, ret. sort of)
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by shoken:
Interesting topic...
I wonder, is there actually so much difference between ranks? For example, is a newly promoted shodan superior to an advanced ni-kyu?
In my prospective, attaining rank symbolizes more responsibility and effort.
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Gold belt
Moderator: Available
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Allen M.
Gold belt
Here's another shade: Colored and striped belts are for the instructor.
When I used to teach large classes of 30 to 40 students on an almost nightly basis, sometimes bringing them through over 11 and more Korean kata plus all their one-steps, three-steps, sparring, etc., I knew just how to break the class into well-defined groups up by merely looking at the colored bands around their waists.
God bless colored belts!
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Allen Moulton from Uechi-ryu Etcetera
When I used to teach large classes of 30 to 40 students on an almost nightly basis, sometimes bringing them through over 11 and more Korean kata plus all their one-steps, three-steps, sparring, etc., I knew just how to break the class into well-defined groups up by merely looking at the colored bands around their waists.
God bless colored belts!
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Allen Moulton from Uechi-ryu Etcetera
Gold belt
AMEN to that, Allen-sama!!!
It's like color-coding files in a drawer, especially when there's more than one instructor at a school and you get caught covering someone else's classes and may not know the students in that group all that well!
Respectfully,
Lee Darrow, C.Ht. (Sandan, ret. sort of)
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Allen M.:
Here's another shade: Colored and striped belts are for the instructor.
When I used to teach large classes of 30 to 40 students on an almost nightly basis, sometimes bringing them through over 11 and more Korean kata plus all their one-steps, three-steps, sparring, etc., I knew just how to break the class into well-defined groups up by merely looking at the colored bands around their waists.
God bless colored belts!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
It's like color-coding files in a drawer, especially when there's more than one instructor at a school and you get caught covering someone else's classes and may not know the students in that group all that well!
Respectfully,
Lee Darrow, C.Ht. (Sandan, ret. sort of)
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Allen M.:
Here's another shade: Colored and striped belts are for the instructor.
When I used to teach large classes of 30 to 40 students on an almost nightly basis, sometimes bringing them through over 11 and more Korean kata plus all their one-steps, three-steps, sparring, etc., I knew just how to break the class into well-defined groups up by merely looking at the colored bands around their waists.
God bless colored belts!
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Bill Stockey
- Posts: 12
- Joined: Mon Oct 11, 1999 6:01 am
- Location: Arlington,VA
- Contact:
Gold belt
I would like for some one to track this down. I started in a style that used white, brown, black but kyus were always used. I have heard this repeated numerous times but I have never seen any thing definite about the introduction of colored belts. Judo has used them for long time and my guess is this came from them since the ranking system did
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LeeDarrow:
Great question, Shoken-sama!
IME (over the past 30 or so years), the ranks in a specific dojo are usually pretty well defined as to skill levels. Once outside that specific dojo, however, there seems to be some pretty wide variation in some styles (Uechi does NOT seem to be one of those styles, BTW!).
Belts (as my Sensei put it) were developed to denote competency. In my style there was (originally as he was taught) White, Green Brown and Black.
Stripes and other colors came much later to cater to the American attitude of wanting something for showing achievement in the short haul and as a reward to students who not only showed prowess and proficiency, but as an award for being there over a longer period (and THAT'S one of the "secrets" of belts - according to him).
A belt is an indicator that someone has taken the time, energy, effort and pain to be able to do certain things in a certain way and to a set of somewhat mutable standards, depending on the review boards. It is also an indicator of UNDERSTANDING of their art, IMO. Or should be.
In some ways, a Belt review committee is similar to the judging panels in competitive ice skating. They judge a performance on certain required moves, set forms (like in old style judging in figure skating where they would literally use a micrometer to measure how perfectly someone had skated over their figure 8) and on style, power accuracy and the like. But- they also work like boxing judges during the fighting portion of an exam and as academic judges on the written portions (should there be any). At least that's my experience of them.
One of the things I appreciate about this forum is that there IS a stress on the academic and intellectual aspects of the art. Some dojo/dojang/kwoon I have visited over the years seem to have one attitude - get in the ring and kick some a$$ - nothing more.
Personally, I think that there's lots more to a MA than that and the award of a belt should reflect that as much as the ability to do good kata or kumite.
Respectfully,
Lee Darrow, C.Ht. (Sandan, ret. sort of)
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LeeDarrow:
Great question, Shoken-sama!
IME (over the past 30 or so years), the ranks in a specific dojo are usually pretty well defined as to skill levels. Once outside that specific dojo, however, there seems to be some pretty wide variation in some styles (Uechi does NOT seem to be one of those styles, BTW!).
Belts (as my Sensei put it) were developed to denote competency. In my style there was (originally as he was taught) White, Green Brown and Black.
Stripes and other colors came much later to cater to the American attitude of wanting something for showing achievement in the short haul and as a reward to students who not only showed prowess and proficiency, but as an award for being there over a longer period (and THAT'S one of the "secrets" of belts - according to him).
A belt is an indicator that someone has taken the time, energy, effort and pain to be able to do certain things in a certain way and to a set of somewhat mutable standards, depending on the review boards. It is also an indicator of UNDERSTANDING of their art, IMO. Or should be.
In some ways, a Belt review committee is similar to the judging panels in competitive ice skating. They judge a performance on certain required moves, set forms (like in old style judging in figure skating where they would literally use a micrometer to measure how perfectly someone had skated over their figure 8) and on style, power accuracy and the like. But- they also work like boxing judges during the fighting portion of an exam and as academic judges on the written portions (should there be any). At least that's my experience of them.
One of the things I appreciate about this forum is that there IS a stress on the academic and intellectual aspects of the art. Some dojo/dojang/kwoon I have visited over the years seem to have one attitude - get in the ring and kick some a$$ - nothing more.
Personally, I think that there's lots more to a MA than that and the award of a belt should reflect that as much as the ability to do good kata or kumite.
Respectfully,
Lee Darrow, C.Ht. (Sandan, ret. sort of)
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Gold belt
Belts serve two functions in Uechi-Ryu:
1) When the beginners do their waukes they all whack their obi, indicating that they're way too close for the block to be effective.
2) When you watch someone who knows how to do sanchin, you can see the torque they put into their strikes by the way their belt moves (among other things).
When I was moving my way up through the kyu ranks I would feel lousy if I did lousy on a test and good if I did well, independent of whether the testing board felt obligated to throw another color at me. The set that's trying to accumulate a rack of colored belts isn't really trying to learn karate.
1) When the beginners do their waukes they all whack their obi, indicating that they're way too close for the block to be effective.
2) When you watch someone who knows how to do sanchin, you can see the torque they put into their strikes by the way their belt moves (among other things).
When I was moving my way up through the kyu ranks I would feel lousy if I did lousy on a test and good if I did well, independent of whether the testing board felt obligated to throw another color at me. The set that's trying to accumulate a rack of colored belts isn't really trying to learn karate.
