There are a group of us that have been defending Okinawan Karate on you tube and have decided that through our overwhelming years of study and experience, we can post our own kata under a pseudonym.
Mine will be "Ichiro Nobudo" get it No Budo
Please join us as we show these little snots (oops did I type that?) That we too can be very creative in our kata!! Then we will wait to see how many of our clips will show up on YouTube done by others as "official Okinawan Karate"!
See these clip and the notes to understand our dilemma:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=QuIIXFm9vd4
http://youtube.com/watch?v=iH5OYRrSX8w
Help me Save Okinawan Karate
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Help me Save Okinawan Karate
Jim Prouty
New England Budo Center
New England Budo Center
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gmattson
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Jim...
You miss the point of these "tournament" kata...
"It ain't the moves - its the scream"!
No one defends themselves with movement now days... the scream is the secret.
You should watch the girls do their "screaming" kata! Wow! One loud and continuous VERY loud scream - usually mouthing a mysterious and possibly ancient Japanese dialect!
"It ain't the moves - its the scream"!
No one defends themselves with movement now days... the scream is the secret.
You should watch the girls do their "screaming" kata! Wow! One loud and continuous VERY loud scream - usually mouthing a mysterious and possibly ancient Japanese dialect!
GEM
"Do or do not. there is no try!"
"Do or do not. there is no try!"
Re: Jim...
George-san,gmattson wrote:You miss the point of these "tournament" kata...
"It ain't the moves - its the scream"!
No one defends themselves with movement now days... the scream is the secret.
You should watch the girls do their "screaming" kata! Wow! One loud and continuous VERY loud scream - usually mouthing a mysterious and possibly ancient Japanese dialect!
Maybe you are correct. I will maybe have to show the ultra secret Ki-less but scream-filled karate kiai!!
I know that you will admonish me for letting the secret out; but it is better than the groans and supposed breathing that sounds like Benjo-ryu!!
Jim Prouty
New England Budo Center
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f.Channell
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I think the fault lies with the tournament judges that allow that to win.
Perhaps not enough traditional Karate judges on the circuit?
I'm judging in a couple weeks at Manny's and if I hear that kind of constipation, I'll suggest a bathroom.
F.
Perhaps not enough traditional Karate judges on the circuit?
I'm judging in a couple weeks at Manny's and if I hear that kind of constipation, I'll suggest a bathroom.
F.
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JOHN THURSTON
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Goshdarn
Hi:
If I did a kata in that manner (which wasn't overly precise-but Perhaps goodfor voice training and leg strengthening) I would feel embarrassed.
If I made that much noise in bed, my wife would throew me out (a non related aside)
Uechi and T'ai chi (my cross training) are 'quiet' and show their strengths internally--so what was that Kata?
just my way of agreeing to help.
www.shiningpeace.com
John
If I did a kata in that manner (which wasn't overly precise-but Perhaps goodfor voice training and leg strengthening) I would feel embarrassed.
If I made that much noise in bed, my wife would throew me out (a non related aside)
Uechi and T'ai chi (my cross training) are 'quiet' and show their strengths internally--so what was that Kata?
just my way of agreeing to help.
www.shiningpeace.com
John
"All Enlightenment Gratefully Accepted"
Re: Goshdarn
That i supposedly "Go Pai Sho" which comes from the Robert Trias's lineage of karate.JOHN THURSTON wrote:Hi:
If I did a kata in that manner (which wasn't overly precise-but Perhaps goodfor voice training and leg strengthening) I would feel embarrassed.
If I made that much noise in bed, my wife would throew me out (a non related aside)
Uechi and T'ai chi (my cross training) are 'quiet' and show their strengths internally--so what was that Kata?
just my way of agreeing to help.
www.shiningpeace.com
John
It is written that Trias started the FIRST dojo in AZ in '49 after training in Singapore after WWII. His style "Shuri-Ryu" according to his bio has roots in Okinawa but he was taught by Chinese masters.
Perhaps George or Van could shed some light on the evasive Trias's history?
http://www.triaskarate.com/Page_2.php (Trias Bio.)
Jim Prouty
New England Budo Center
New England Budo Center
I believe Go Pai Sho is a RyueiRyu form, taught by Sakamoto Sensei on Okinawa. He is featured on the YOE video "Three Major Schools of Okinawan KarateDo" Vol. 1.
On that same video is the now-popular Sandairyu performance by Toyama Sensei, and the scenes done in the Kadena Dojo of Shinjo Kiyohide Sensei.
I can't say whether Sakamoto Sensei taught those sound effects to go with the form, but his personal performance doesn't include them...!
Sumako was a Ryueiryu student when she was in college in California many years back. She recognized the kata almost immediately. Her teacher was an Okinawan student of Sakamoto Sensei studying in college there too.
Regards,
Seizan
On that same video is the now-popular Sandairyu performance by Toyama Sensei, and the scenes done in the Kadena Dojo of Shinjo Kiyohide Sensei.
I can't say whether Sakamoto Sensei taught those sound effects to go with the form, but his personal performance doesn't include them...!
Sumako was a Ryueiryu student when she was in college in California many years back. She recognized the kata almost immediately. Her teacher was an Okinawan student of Sakamoto Sensei studying in college there too.
Regards,
Seizan
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f.Channell
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According to his book Trias was a student of Yasuhiro Konishi, a student of Choki Motobu. He stated that Motobu-ryu came about later, meaning I suppose it was Shuri-ryu originally.
His first art was Hsing-yi. Supposedly the Chinese root of Shuri-ryu. He learned this on the Solomon Islands after sparring a chinese master who was an emissary to the British occupied island during WWII who defeated him. He was then the armed services middleweight champion.
All of his Kata are in the book, I'll look up that one. He also states he added Goju kata to his system.
F.
this is all from his book. "The Pinnacle of Karate".
His first art was Hsing-yi. Supposedly the Chinese root of Shuri-ryu. He learned this on the Solomon Islands after sparring a chinese master who was an emissary to the British occupied island during WWII who defeated him. He was then the armed services middleweight champion.
All of his Kata are in the book, I'll look up that one. He also states he added Goju kata to his system.
F.
this is all from his book. "The Pinnacle of Karate".
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f.Channell
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As an aside:
In Ihor Sensei's book on Uechi. He has photo's of Kanei Uechi's dojo and Trias, his daughter, and other students are present in the pictures.
Don't know what the visit was for. But he did seem to have a relationship with Trias.
F.
In Ihor Sensei's book on Uechi. He has photo's of Kanei Uechi's dojo and Trias, his daughter, and other students are present in the pictures.
Don't know what the visit was for. But he did seem to have a relationship with Trias.
F.
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JOHN THURSTON
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No Second Thoughts
Hi:
Seizan; so good to see you post.
As in Fred's training, perhaps, my first and second "Dan" certificates were signed by Mr. Trias.(USKA)
So he had not second thoughts about issuing diplomas for a Non related style.
Supposedly Hsing-I, Leu hei Ba Fa, T'ai chi, and the many systems of KF are "the four jewels in China's martial arts crown, according to my Sifu.
I studied Ba Fa a bit and T'ai Chi a lot, beleiveing that the principles of TC can benefit can greatly benefit Uechi Students.
This is not to say "all is not in Uechi" as GEM has correctly stated-but sometimes on has to dig deep.
I saw the Seichin "Bunkai" at the camp, and the "push" in one of the applications can have only come from one source-TC.
However, having said that, if one examines the Zenkustu Dachi Elbow strike in Seisan and Sanserui-a properly trained student will know how to apply a "push' with great force when a Higi Tsuki is not, ah, convenient as when the opponent's shoulder and arm are already placed in the line of contact.
I also believe firmly that some T'ai Chi instructors can articulate certain matters ( grounding and 'jing', which Sensei Maloney refers to as "time on target') in a understandable if in a different fashion that is currently the case in Uechi Dojos.
t'ai Chi has its own grappling system (Chin Na-mostly stand up) and I would very much be surprised if the Uechi kata do not hold just as many 'secrets' in this area as TC.
I know little about Master Trias' real style and history of training, but, I will agree, certainly, that the Karateka pictured appeared in much better shape that myself.
Besides, I have two Diplomas signed by him. (not that they mean much to me at this time)
I can't abide that screaming.
But Kuma De, I think you need not fear for Okinawan Karate. It is too deep and too broad.
Fred, perhaps you should mark down (subtract points) for excessive screaming, as, beyond a certain point, it detracts from actual observations of technique and form.
However, the deep horse stances show a good deal of strength.
Examining Go Pai Sho technically, the complete turn of the head is not consistent with the fact that the overturning of the head tends to destroy one's 'connection' thru the body to the ground-but, perhaps that is compensated for by the extreme depth of the stances.
John
www.shiningpeace.com
Seizan; so good to see you post.
As in Fred's training, perhaps, my first and second "Dan" certificates were signed by Mr. Trias.(USKA)
So he had not second thoughts about issuing diplomas for a Non related style.
Supposedly Hsing-I, Leu hei Ba Fa, T'ai chi, and the many systems of KF are "the four jewels in China's martial arts crown, according to my Sifu.
I studied Ba Fa a bit and T'ai Chi a lot, beleiveing that the principles of TC can benefit can greatly benefit Uechi Students.
This is not to say "all is not in Uechi" as GEM has correctly stated-but sometimes on has to dig deep.
I saw the Seichin "Bunkai" at the camp, and the "push" in one of the applications can have only come from one source-TC.
However, having said that, if one examines the Zenkustu Dachi Elbow strike in Seisan and Sanserui-a properly trained student will know how to apply a "push' with great force when a Higi Tsuki is not, ah, convenient as when the opponent's shoulder and arm are already placed in the line of contact.
I also believe firmly that some T'ai Chi instructors can articulate certain matters ( grounding and 'jing', which Sensei Maloney refers to as "time on target') in a understandable if in a different fashion that is currently the case in Uechi Dojos.
t'ai Chi has its own grappling system (Chin Na-mostly stand up) and I would very much be surprised if the Uechi kata do not hold just as many 'secrets' in this area as TC.
I know little about Master Trias' real style and history of training, but, I will agree, certainly, that the Karateka pictured appeared in much better shape that myself.
Besides, I have two Diplomas signed by him. (not that they mean much to me at this time)
I can't abide that screaming.
But Kuma De, I think you need not fear for Okinawan Karate. It is too deep and too broad.
Fred, perhaps you should mark down (subtract points) for excessive screaming, as, beyond a certain point, it detracts from actual observations of technique and form.
However, the deep horse stances show a good deal of strength.
Examining Go Pai Sho technically, the complete turn of the head is not consistent with the fact that the overturning of the head tends to destroy one's 'connection' thru the body to the ground-but, perhaps that is compensated for by the extreme depth of the stances.
John
www.shiningpeace.com
"All Enlightenment Gratefully Accepted"
The fact that he studied with Konishi Sensei has been debunked as a fraudulent statement by Konishi himself prior to his passing, and his son the current head of the association. Furthermore, my personal study of the subject and discussions with Howard High, a senior student of Ryobu-kai in the USA and a student of Kiyoshi Yamazaki of CA a student of Konishi and a student of Yasuhiro Konishi, the son, of Japan;has said that the photos & certificates written in English floating around the web are not true as Konishi the elder did not write English.f.Channell wrote:According to his book Trias was a student of Yasuhiro Konishi, a student of Choki Motobu. He stated that Motobu-ryu came about later, meaning I suppose it was Shuri-ryu originally.
His first art was Hsing-yi. Supposedly the Chinese root of Shuri-ryu. He learned this on the Solomon Islands after sparring a chinese master who was an emissary to the British occupied island during WWII who defeated him. He was then the armed services middleweight champion.
All of his Kata are in the book, I'll look up that one. He also states he added Goju kata to his system.
F.
this is all from his book. "The Pinnacle of Karate".
http://www.shuri-ryu.org/shuri-ryu/konishi.htm
You will see that the 9th Dan certificate is written on Trias's own dan certificates???
This is Howard's own history of Konishi:
http://www.shuriway.co.uk/konishi.html
Jim Prouty
New England Budo Center
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f.Channell
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So what do you do Jim when you study with a guy for 20 years and later find his lineage suspect or bull?
Tough place to be in.
Sure it's not the first or last time.
F.
Tough place to be in.
Sure it's not the first or last time.
F.
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