Empty Hand vs Blade

[Glenn]

The feasability of unarmed defense against a bladed weapon is frequently discussed in the modern martial arts, so I was intrigued when I was browsing through a book on World War II Infantry Tactics at Barnes and Noble last night and came across a picture from a 1942 U.S. army training manual showing an unarmed soldier parrying a bayonet thrust by slapping the side of the blade with his hand. So I thought I would see what I could find online:

Not certain of the time period of the pictures that went into this animation, but the parry leading into an elbow strike looks familiar:

U.S. Marine Corps Individual Combat Course, July 1944 describes the use of judo in marine corp training during WWII, and for illustration they show a 1943 photo of an unarmed soldier defending against a bayonet thrust. I gotta say, grabbing the rifle barrel makes more sense than parrying the blade.

Judo instruction is one of the high spots in the life of the latest addition to the Leatherneck Marines here [at Montford Point, North Carolina]. An instructor shows a recruit how to make the enemy's bayonet useless. Cpl. Arvin Lou Ghazlo, USMC, giving judo instructions to Pvt. Ernest C. Jones, USMCR.

[Glenn]

On a slightly different note, many of the techniques in FM 21-150, Unarmed Defense for the American Soldier, June 30, 1942, Section VI, Defenses against Kicks bare a striking (no pun intended) resemblance to certain Uechi (among other Eastern) techniques. And this before karate had been introduced to the U.S. It could be from a judo influence though.

[Bill Glasheen]

It's a big mistake focusing on the blade, although that's what the untrained victim will do. Better to focus on your own movement (off the trajectory of the blade) as well as the structure behind the blade.

An offensive mindset is also very important. It's much more difficult to react after-the-fact.

Some of what they teach people for self-defense reminds me of Duck and Cover. You wonder if they're just trying to keep people from schitting their britches before they ever go out on the battlefield. I suppose some confidence can be better than a total deer-in-the-headlamps response.

- Bill

[Glenn]

Notice the positioning of the defender in the first picture above (from 1943), he has clearly offset to the side of the weapon, leaving him in a good position to control the weapon and attack the attacker while controlling the attackers movements by pinning the foot.

The picture (from 1942) I saw in the book last night had the defender standing still in front of the attacker and just slapping the blade off course, but there was no controlling of anything by the defender so they end up essentially back at square one where the attacker is free to attack again. Unfortunately I cannot find this picture online, it makes a nice contrast to the one above. In particular, when you compare the two it would seem that the picture above reflects lessons learned in the year of combat that occurred between the two pictures. The training in 1942 probably was not much different from pre-war training, but by 1943 they had a lot more to go on, and more importantly experienced combat veterens doing the training.

[fivedragons]

Glenn, the pictures you posted are the essence of tiger kung fu. Ever look at the OSS combatives manuals?

They were the distillation of training and experience in judo/jujutsu and the Shanghai police.

Not to be understood as an improvement or replacement for the disciplines they came from, but as a time sensitive training methodology for natural athletes, who were "born killers" with the mindset to overcome the enemy, notwithstanding exotic fighting methods.

Uechi is tiger kung fu.

And crane, and dragon.

And leopard and snake.

Buddhist and taoist.

soft and hard.

The real deal.

[fivedragons]

Uechi isn't a style of fighting, or a box of techniques.

It is a systematic training methodology designed to bring the practitioner face to face with the instinctive and intuitive "other" who knows how to use the human body and mind as a weapon.

Most don't really want to learn this, so they don't.

If you come to uechi looking for self defense, you're not going to appreciate the fact that it's not about self defense.
Kung fu is all about the physical, mental and spirtitual discovery of the "beast".

The beast that inhabits every civilized person's psyche, cowering in the shadows, fearful and projecting fear on all it surveys, because it isn't acknowledged.

Real kung fu teaches that the worst demons are nothing more than sad grasping thoughts that need to be looked square in the eyes with compassion.

Repression is the real evil, not violence.

Violence and hatred are just symptoms of repression.

[Chris McKaskell]

Trashing bozos is one thing.

Mastering the self? Another......

[f.Channell]

I trained Judo for 6-7 years and just started training again.
I don't see any traditional Judo technique in either of those pictures.
Perhaps it's a Jujitsu style.

Judo was kind of adopted into the air force after WWII. Mifune put on a demo and had a match with one of his men and an air force general integrated it in some way into training. According to my reading anyway.

The air force I believe at one time had their own Judo ranking organization.
I know they had some tournaments in the 50's.

My dad told me he did Jujitsu training in the navy in basic during WWII.

F.

[fivedragons]

Tiger kung fu in less than fifty words:

Grab the enemy by the face and slam his head into the ground.

This can be accomplished using body weight and momentum, the tiger applies the entire strength of his body to the weakest
point of his prey's anatomy. The neck.

In classical forms, there is usually a downward parrying motion
by the off hand, in concert with the body shift, and the attacking hand, which can be applied to the chin, the throat, the nose and
or the eyes.

This is not a "hit" that is withdrawn, and surveyed for damage,
but rather the opening of a series of savage movements that end with the enemy incapacitated.

Kung fu is not a freaking joke.

[Glenn]

My question regarding the possibility of the OSS being influenced by jujitsu and tiger kungfu or the navy training in jujitsu in WWII: Was what they were teaching truly adopted from Japan and China or was it independently created, and we are merely using the Asian names now because of similarites that we see 60 years later? Did the navy call it jujitsu in WWII?

Clearly there was some cross-cultural transmission, the Japanese had adopted western military techniques and technology and judo was known in the west prior to WWII. But in all the MA history I have read I have yet to see where any westerner trained in karate, kungfu, or anything other than judo prior to the end of WWII. The prevailing thought seems to be that prior to that time teachers were secretive about their teachings in general, and opposed to teaching it to westerners in particular.

So what are some thoughts here, does this WWII training represent strictly western martial arts or was there influence by eastern martial arts?

[Victor Smith]

Judo has a group of traditional kata perserving self defense techniques, techniques against grappling armoured opponents and techniques of very subtle movement principles.

When Judo became an Olympic sport a lot of organizations discontinued these kata (and many were reserved for only advanced judoka) from my reading. I believe it's quite possible this might have been used for the pre-WWII studies.

Teddy Roosevelt while President received training in Aiki Jutsu, and Judo was well established in the States before WWII.

The following might be useful to compare traditional Judo training to the current issue empty hand against the knife.

judo kime no kata
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvxJYM_LsHw
Kime no Kata / judo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2o-vz4w ... re=related

Goshin Jitsu No Kata / Judo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxbFOP-x ... re=related

Juno kata
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yf5sVaFx ... re=related

koshiki no kata ostia 2006
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3xFGrWX ... re=related
KOSHIKI NO KATA (URA)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJRL5XhU ... re=related

[Glenn]

Here is an article from Black Belt that supports what fivedragons and Fred have mentioned regarding the introduction of jujitsu and other eastern arts into western military training prior to and during WWII:
Close Combat
Some excerpts:

Col. William E. Fairbairn, an Englishman who worked his way up from conand stable to assistant commissioner of the Shanghai Municipal Police prior to World War II. Along the way, he developed a system of armed and unarmed combat that enabled his officers to survive some of the toughest streets on earth.

BACK IN TIME

In the early 1900s, Shanghai was the most violent city in China, if not the entire world. Muggings, armed robberies and kidnappings plagued its population, while gangs ran amok and opium dealers did whatever was necessary to ply their trade. One night in 1908, Fairbairn was patrolling the brothel district when he was nearly beaten to death by a gang of criminals.

He awoke in a hospital and fortuitously noticed a placard near his bed that read, “Professor Okada, jujutsu and bonesetting.” Upon checking out, Fairbairn embarked on a course of study that would include jujutsu, judo and various Chinese arts. He eventually earned a black belt in judo and jujutsu, and in 1910 he was promoted to sergeant of musketry and drill, which meant he was now responsible for training recruits in the techniques they would rely on to save their own lives. Fairbairn decided to seek out further instruction in a variety of fighting systems, especially ones that dealt with the situations his trainees might face on the street.

Fairbairn retired in 1940 at age 55. He then returned to England, where he was charged with training commandos and elite members of the home guard. His curriculum was designed to provide soldiers and operatives with the skill and confidence needed to defeat an enemy in close combat. He also instructed various American and Allied commando units, including the Office of Strategic Services, the precursor of the CIA.

Although the system Fairbairn originally taught to the police contained a variety of restraining holds, the skills he passed to the military focused on strikes. Police officers were supposed to arrest suspects, he reasoned, while soldiers and agents were required to dispatch their enemies as quickly and ruthlessly as possible.

Hand-to-hand combat was extremely important to OSS agents because they frequently had to operate in occupied areas while masquerading as foreign nationals. Because they often encountered German checkpoints, they could not carry firearms and thus had to rely on the empty-hand training provided by Fairbairn and his instructors.

While Fairbairn originally drew a great deal from jujutsu and judo, the brand of close combat he taught during World War II emphasized the atemi, or striking aspects, of the martial arts because they are easier to apply and have a more lethal effect than do throws and locks. Many of those blows are similar to traditional martial arts techniques, but Cestari claims subtle differences exist. The most important characteristic of World War II close-combat strikes, he says, is that they are composed of simple gross-motor movements.

They are also non-telegraphic because they originate from wherever the striking limb is. No chambering or cocking is involved. In each strike, the weapon takes the most direct route to the target. “Any time you bring your hand away from an attacker, you are alerting him,” Cestari insists.

Above all, World War II close combat stresses the need to pre-emptively attack as soon as a threat becomes apparent, Cestari says. In his Notes for Instructors on Close Combat, Fairbairn stressed the importance of hitting first, and Cestari adheres to that philosophy 100 percent.

[cxt]

Glen

Interesting observation about the Japanese adopting western military aspects.

For a while, western boxing was a pretty popular sport in parts of china/taiwan.

Even some guys that would be looked upon as "traditional" these days studied it---if memory serves.

[Bill Glasheen]

[Teddy] Roosevelt had been involved in both boxing and wrestling. After witnessing a demonstration of judo by Yoshiaka Yamashita against a wrestler at the White House, Roosevelt began studying the art under this teacher, eventually becoming the first American to achieve the rank of brown belt.

- FightingArts.com

[TSDguy]

The first postings remind me a bit of the bayonette exercises of the Irish drill sergeant in "Glory".

Who knows how accurate that was for a Civil War drill, but it certainly seems believable. The concept behind the move doesn't necessarily have to come from JJ; it's pretty universal.