Two-handed nuki strike in Seisan

[John Giacoletti]

This seems to be one of many Uechi techniques from China that are combinations of striking and grappling moves.

It's the two handed diagonal fingertip strike that's performed to the rear in Seisan. In the bunkai application, it's the move that's used to grab and turn the opponent to the right and, in the bunkai applications that I've seen, into the sword strike presumably of his partner.

I believe the Japanese terminology for the technique is "morote gedan nuki." Is there a preferred target? I've seen it applied anywhere from the hips to just below the rib cage.

The technique came with a legendary explanation that the old masters had such strong fingers and thrusts that they were actually grabbing entrails

What I was taught was that the double strike dented or punched in the abdomanal area just below the ribs. You could then grab the flesh with the lower three fingers of each hand while at the same time making a shoken fist with the thumb and first finger. With this massive pinch in place, one next twisted both wrists in an outward, upward direction pulling your arms into a sanchin posture "morote" shoken kamae." The resultant pain from the twisting, pinching grab raised the opponent to his toes and thence he could be turned when you pivoted and used as your shield.

Are there other "understandings" or applications? The same technique appears in Seichin but the turn there is to the left. I've seen a Seichin bunkai but without the sword so I guess that the opponent is just used as a body between youself and an attacker.

In the Seisan bunkai I've seen all sorts of belt and gi grabs to move the opponent, so is there a trend away from what I was initially taught? These alternate grabs seem to get away from the pain and damage that the grab and pinch manoever can inflict, i. e. they are more theatrical than a truly punishing technique.

How is this technique taught and practiced since you won't have many friends if you really do it correctly?

[Stryke]

I like variations to the neck where perhaps theres a collar grab and two shokens to sides .

Also like it in a pure grappling sense as double underhooks , or perhaps actually getting the shokens in the armpits .

I have to admit the grab the fat application doesnt appeal to me , I just feel my heads far too open doing that despite whatever pain response .

I do like it as a full body lock though . It`s a curious sequence , that I havent really been fully sold on yet .

[Rick Wilson]

The lower target I use is done the lines of the groin area rather than the abdominal area (lower or other). Use with a very aggressive pounce or done up close when a person is getting “in your face.”

As Marcus says they can be used for the neck as well.

One variation is to briefly prevent a clinch by using the heels of the palms against the opponent’s hip bones. Creates a momentary space within which to strike.

[benzocaine]

Thanks John for the great post.

I was laughed at by a certain 7 dan when I told bim about the fat grab.

He told me it was jabbing the shokens just over the floating ribs under the pecs. You can then lift your oponent. Hurts like a mothuh but hard to actually do..forget about the "dump" of adrenaline you would get for real.

I like he grab myself.

Marcus.

I have to admit the grab the fat application doesnt appeal to me , I just feel my heads far too open doing that despite whatever pain response .

Good point, but remember you are pulling your opnent into you fast, right after striking him. The natural response to being pulled into someone is to pull away. That's why judo works so well . Or that's my hypotheses

[dpasquarelli]

When I was training this bunkai for my shodan test it was with a 250 pound partner so there was very little chance of me moving him. As a result I was also taught that I could use the grab as a pivot to come behind my opponent and thus stack him between myself and the other attacker. While not a damaging move, it seems quicker and easier if "stacking" is the objective.

[Bill Glasheen]

No, I don't believe anyone was penetrating flesh with the double nukites. Sorry... I've just put scalpel to flesh too often to believe that someone's fingers (of doom) can penetrate flesh. It ain't gonna happen, except maybe against someone who is so old that they aren't going to be a serious threat anyhow.

This is just another one of those Chinese "charming tendencies to exaggerate."

There are however some good places to use the nukites and shokens. I teach my students to reach at the "ideal" level, and grab whatever is there. If they are tall, I grab the belt and give them a wedgie. (I wonder what the Chinese word for wedgie is... ). If they are shorter, I thrust my fingers into the arm pits and grab the edge of the pectoralis muscle. Anything in-between means I grab whatever gets their attention.

Ask my students; no extraordinary abilities required to make this work. But by all means, make each other uncomfortable in class. If you aren't putting a raspberry on the skin now and then, you aren't training.

The way I see it, it's the principle of the "elevation" response applied in any one of several locations on the body. That and some basic mechanics (coat hanger structure, conservation of angular momentum, etc.) make it work.

- Bill